*teacher make a great deal less than than professionals with similar education.

*one might think Alberta with conservative governments since the depression are a good bench mark. Alberta teachers make $ 93000.

*teachers get the summer off because society demands it not because teachers asked for it.

*same with Christmas and March break.

*ask a family that has teachers how much they work

*teachers cannot deduct any work related expenses from income tax.

*Canada has the world’s best education system. Teachers produced that.

The last sentence in this blog answers the question about whether or not teachers are over-paid.  They wouldn’t make more money working elsewhere, plus they would work longer days and months longer during the year.  You can see where people are working who have a general arts degree or a degree in psychology, sociology, economics, and even some of the sciences.  If they don’t have a teachers’ certificate many with these degrees are working as store clerks.  Working as a store clerk is an honourable profession, however it’s not unionized and therefore clerks who have a university degree make less than a third and work much longer days, Saturdays, Sundays, and all summer long, plus Xmas and March break.  Eight months to get a teaching certificate does not warrant the salaries teachers get, plus the younger ones are incompetent in basic skills like arithmetic, spelling, grammar and composition.  Their salaries, benefits, and enormous amount of time off only reflects the fact that public sector unions have become very powerful and their unions will continue to demand more and more from fatigued taxpayers while delivering less and less when it comes to quality education, or whatever their profession is.

Teacher bashing screeds seem to have lost you the few allies you had within teachers. Conservative and traditional teachers say to HE double hockey sticks With those people. They hate teachers.

Another incentive not often mentioned is that educators are not held to account to their day to day decisions made on the behalf of the students. Sure the educators are accountable to their superiors, but even the superiors in education are rarely held accountable for decisions that imposes negative or unexpected outcomes that causes harm to the student and their education.

I would not mind the teachers salaries at all, if each and everyone was held to account at the same level of other professions. Accountant or medical doctor or engineer or lawyer have the high standard of making decisions on the behalf of their clients or patients based on their expertise. However, educators of the K to12 education system have set the bar so low, the educators can pretty well get away with what I would call for the lack of a better term, education malpractice.

Earlier this week, deep in the teachers’ unions files reading upon Alberta and Ontario new initiatives of ‘Inspiring Education’ models, I came upon the latest calls of teachers having autonomy in the classroom when it comes to curriculum and pedagogy. However and sadly to inform readers, the educators don’t want any accountability measures towards their autonomy,  and is calling for the elimination of standard testing, but as well as student diagnostic testing. Apparently the latter takes up far too much time and believe it or not, impinges on the educator’s professional expertise and their ability to decide. Diagnostic testing is now another bad boy that are rudely imposing upon decisions of a classroom educator who insists a student does not have a reading problem, and the diagnostic testing is screaming out the low score on phonemic awareness.

I certainly would not mind if teachers were pay $100,000 if they were held accountable for their decisions made on the behalf of their students. My youngest was a victim or another casualty, where accountability is set so low, the classroom educators were able to ignore my child’s reading struggles and sleep at night. My child can read, as the educator pointed out. Sure she could read in the primary grades, because she is very good at memorizing words. An reading assessment would have discovered low phonemic awareness, but now the educators want diagnostic testing out of the classroom and beyond the classroom. For what?  To set the accountability bar even lower!

1) Teaching - if you want to do it well -  takes more than the hours spent in the classroom in the best circumstances.

You need to correct tests and homework, you need to make or adjust lesson plans. It is at minimum another 6-7 hours per week in the best of circumstances:
a) you have mastery the subject
b) you have a good curriculum that you can use as is both for teaching and for homework or you already lessons plans that you can reuse
c) you need only 1 lesson plan not 3 or 4 or 5 because all the students in the class have the pre-requisite knowledge.

The above circumstances do not happen most of the times in Ontario’s public schools
a) a lot of teachers do not have mastery of the subject
They have to teach math with a BA in arts, they have to teach science with a BA in Phys Ed .. and so on and so forth. It is a bit better in high school but in elementary it is pure chaos.
b) the Ontario elementary curriculum is very poor in my opinion.
c) in the majority of classes grade 3 and higher there are at least 3 if not 4 or 5 levels in a class. To do a good job you need separate lesson plans and homework assignments for each.

Unless at least some of the above are addressed it is unrealistic to expect good teaching.

2) Pay ?
I agree with Bev that outside of public schools this people’s job options would be much poorer and much less paid (30 to 60% less, even 40% to 70% if we take into account pensions and other benefits). That’s not people’s fault; they just followed the rules and took advantage of the existing system.

Personally I wouldn’t mind the pay since I think done well teaching is a demanding job, I mind very much the extremely poor quality we get for what we pay.

The problems are the selection into the teacher programs, the teachers’ training and then the lack of assessment of teachers’ on the job performance.

Yes, and imagine. They will not be fired. They will not be checked for results and they will not be asked to do anything by parents. They carry themselves like royalty even though their education is substandard for they get their degree say from : Daemon College in NY.  Teachers are grossly overpaid. Society should reward the good teachers. Those liked by parents and students. If teachers decide to slag off he or she can do it easily on the expense of somebody else future.  No, they would not get paid more for their education elsewhere. Most of them would be unemployed if they didn’t have a brother, a friend, or any other relative who gets them into the job. When the hiring of teachers will be based on merit. Are teachers psychologically evaluated for any disorders. My son’s last teacher was a psycho.  Nobody knew because her classroom was closed and behind the door she could torture kids psychologically as much as she wanted.  Are their being checked for criminal record?  How their suitability for the job is being evaluated? Their degrees are of secondary importance their personal predispositions and suitability for working with kids is. Hire by these criteria, eliminate nepotism, check their performance and pay them well. Now sorry ...the way things are teachers are handouts givers power pushers, lazy and uncaring ... but well, they were hired by their relatives!

The deliberate myopia of OQE/society for quality education is why they are going the way of the dinosaurs.

Doug and others on this line of conversation are spot on- ask people who have a teacher in the family how easy it is.

Not only do teachers work hard - they organize - at a level that many of the bloggers resent.  How does that work in their cognitive synapses? How can intelligent people argue simultaneously that   teachers cannot do the simple task of teaching yet they can keep political/power hungry wolves at bay?  How does such incompetence in the classroom lead to so much efficacy on the political landscape?

Bev and Nancy regularly post on how the instruction in the classroom is lacking ....... they speak with authority of what is lacking….....yet they cannot move the political compass.

Dissonance is a great teacher.  Teachers are effective in the classroom and in the political landscape.  Why?  Because they are effective -period.

Mirka, don’t break your arm patting yourself on the back:  it’s not a great mystery as to how the powerful teachers unions became the way they are, but the current circumstances are such that it was easy for all the psu’s to become powerful.  It’s called a government monopoly. 
Because the teachers unions are powerful they protect teachers who are unable to spell, properly teach grammar and composition (the few times it’s actually done) and flounder in math.  They’re unqualified, but the unions won’t allow boards to get rid of them.
 
You’re right, we can’t move the political compass, and having a mostly left-winged media who don’t print the facts further empowers the teachers’ unions and weakens the people who not only want change, but who are actually paying the educrats’ salaries, benefits, and gold-plated pensions.

One more thing:  teaching is the only profession that always wants to tell you about how hard they work.  I suspect it’s a union ploy and I always turned a deaf ear, and, frankly short days and three months’ vacation is not hard work.  One teacher used to have the audacity to call me at work at 2:15 when he was done for the day, interrupting my work schedule.  Why did he think that I had time to talk while I was at work?  Was this because he had plenty of time to do nothing but talk during school hours?

One of the things some posters cannot seem to Grasp is that the vast majority of parents support the public school system, the teachers it employs and are more than satisfied with the results for their children and for the country. They number in the millions annually.

You, on the other are a very small band of malcontents. Most of the time you are just parroting talking points from the American far right.

Part 1 of 4

Mirka, here comes the uninformed parent, as classified in the radical education theories and research of the K to 12 educationalists. News flash Mirka, parents as a collective group will never be known to become organized and well funded as the organized public education establishment and their components. The parents’ collective strength is our diversity that always will threatened the established public K to 12 authority and expertise. However, that threat only actualizes if the parents become organized and enters into the political and legal arena to do battle with the public K to 12 education establishment. That said, organization skills of educators are irrelevant to the topic, but what Mirka actually means is that the teachers’ union have high status when it comes to political/social capital and influence over the unorganized parents’ collective. Nice try Mirka, but this uninformed parent has been taught in the days when teachers used to impart knowledge such as rhetoric debate, evidence based and logic in order for us uniformed students would produced quality writing. Along the way, I picked up important skills that I never found much use for until 12 years ago when the public K to 12 education system, decided to toss my child off the ramp that leads to the education doors.

Earlier today, I was going to respond to Doug’s post and than along came Mirka’s post. I found the energy tonight to collect my evidence to support my hypothesis of how choice and parents are walking down the middle of the two extremes.  Two separate camps joined like Siamese twins with smiling faces of hidden agendas and ideological plans that has nothing to do with teaching a child to read, let alone provide students with an education. Now for your listening pleasure, the background music - Smiling Faces - it will provide the proper atmosphere as one will be wading into the two polar extremes operating presently, and has been since the 1960s. But don’t take my word for it, let the experts, the educationalists and parents with high political and social capital and influence take the stage.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8CJZcVi5BA4

Smiling faces tell lies and I’ve got the proof - It is apt and fitting start to respond to the false narratives of the public K to 12 education establishment to reveal the hidden political agendas. Parents walking down the middle do not need to dropped their cultural beliefs and values. Nor do they need to dropped their political beliefs. The diversity is their strength. Unfortunately, the public K to 12 education establishment has this funny idea that parents and their children can be manage and control to work for the best interests of the public K to 12 education system and their many hidden agendas. It has been an ongoing agenda since the 1970s on a global level. Foolish to be sure, historically speaking the organized groups of high political, wealth and social capital has always tried to managed the affairs of groups with less political, wealth and social capital by managing and controlling their actions and behaviours. Some would say in a civil society, that would be good. I agree but that is providing the higher status organized groups has the best interests of the people they are trying to control. Alas, smiling faces of the public education establishment tells lies and I’ve got the proof.

Mirka certainly tells the truth of the educators being organized and are politically effective. The education faculties are the main networks to filtered the hidden agendas of the education establishment collective, by way of curriculum, instructional practices, education theories and pedagogy philosophies. One very important educator are the curriculum experts and teacher education. As teachers are trained, they become change agents to convinced the parents, the students and the communities that education must be provided via through the political windows rather than delivering education services. In the 21st century, education decisions are no longer decided what is best for the individual student or the classroom of student but are decided on the political premises of the education establishment. One such educator is Kala Tollefson - her CV - http://ciapps.csuci.edu/FacultyBiographies/kaia-joan.tollefson

One of her books that are in the teachers faculties - “Review In our current educational world of ruthless individualism, Kaia Tollefson attempts to reassemble the pieces…” http://aquablaster.org/meta/Kaia-Tollefson/m335702/  Or this review - “When parents and teachers discuss and uncover the politics behind the top-down accountability movement in education, they are engaged in “volatile knowing,” according to Tollefson (education, California State U. Channel Islands), and are enabled to counter with a move towards accountability focused on the needs of the child. … ” http://www.highbeam.com/doc/1G1-178635104.html

Part 2 of 4

It took a while to locate a web site willing to offer a glimpse of the contents of what is a very expensive book to buy. Google books comes to the rescue - http://books.google.ca/books/about/Volatile_Knowing.html?id=XEorymTsk28C&redir_esc=y

And another brief bio and another book of child centered learning - http://www.sagepub.com/authorDetails.nav?contribId=617871

Otherwise she is not on Wikipedia, but is cited often in the education political blogs and other political blogs. Please note she is a constructivist and as such, constructivism theory is used upon the students and parents to reworked and constantly reinforced the narratives of the public education establishment. One of the narratives, no criticism towards the hard working teachers. That narrative for me went out of my mind set, because I am surrounded by teachers who happened to live nearby. Oh my, what I have seen and heard and sometimes my neighbour who is a teacher will approached me, I asked me nicely to keep it quiet. Good thing I am not a gossiper or better yet, teachers who live near me can rest easy, that I am not a gossiper.

More on that later, back to Kala who represents the typical mindset of the education establishment. Even the title of the book, ‘Volatile Knowing: Parents, Teachers, and the Censored Story of Accountability in America’s Public Schools” suggest truths will be reveal. Question is whose truths and what realites?  It is interesting how Kala views parents as being unknowing yet unstable against the well organized machine of the reform crowd of accountability. The educators will come to the rescue to saved the parents from certain doom. Rather odd, the educators at the school and school board levels are so resistance to provide parents information and knowledge that serves the best interests of their children. I found only one decent review on the Daily Kos. Its one of favourite haunts of educators that leans politically towards Marxism. So it will have to do. http://www.dailykos.com/story/2008/05/27/523584/-Constructivism-revived-in-NCLB-s-shadow-two-books

“What’s most impressive about Volatile Knowing, though, is how Tollefson has broken down the rituals imposed upon the accountability movement, and shown how they form a sort of “discipline” which continually subordinates the participants in schooling to the will of external authorities.  Tollefson identifies several instruments of discipline, picked out of Michel Foucault’s Discipline and Punish, and shows from them how schools have become imprisoning, “totalitarian” institutions under the will of the accountability movement.” 

Confirmation that I always thought schools were like prisons. However, I never thought to blame the conditions and operations of schools on some pencil pusher creating accountability measures. I have always thought the conditions and operations of the schools have always been in the hands and the power of the educators of the local schools using their political and social capital to reform and change. How naive of me eh?  The educators at the bottom are only willing to make changes that are in the best interests of the educators and thus, why sometimes the schools operate like prisons with the heavy emphasis on the rules/regulation regime to keep students and parents in line. After all can’t have a parent causing a fuss when the educator tosses their child in one of those ‘calming rooms’ or as parents called them the ‘rubber room’ of various colours. Last time I read a story which was three months ago on a calming room of a Canadian school, the colour was black. Real calming effect that black colour is, and I wonder if the parent has carry out her threat of not having her kid to go back to school. I sometimes wonder why the educators do not see their own creation of dissonance that is aiding into driving parents down the middle trying to avoid the smiling faces of the educators and the education establishment.

Moving unto the other extreme is the enemy of the education establishment. Of course she comes with high political and social capital as well, but she is also a parent. On Wikipedia - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charlotte_Thomson_Iserbyt

Now she wrote a book back in 1999, and should write another short book to cover the first two decades of the 21st century. It is called, The Deliberate Dumbing Down of America.  http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=2&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CDQQFjAB&url=http://www.deliberatedumbingdown.com/MomsPDFs/DDDoA.sml.pdf&ei=eUJHU4ymK7PSsASg5YDoDg&usg=AFQjCNEdwnpYPS1iBYi3G82ADVuvoMoh2Q&sig2=PjqN4nnpjndGCA7YqBGo6Q&bvm=bv.64507335,d.cWc

Part 3 of 4

The Wikipedia link, provides the background of Charlotte Thomson Iserbyt.  She fights the educators on the political battle grounds owned by the educators. She is principled and is willing to risked her job, which is unlike the educators of the education establishment. “In 1982 Reagan relieved her of her duties after leaking an important technology grant for computerized learning—Project BEST: “Better Education Skills through Technology”[10] brought about by the scholarly writings and a large study by an education specialist named Dr. John I. Goodlad at the Center for Educational Renewal at the University of Washington, originally from British Columbia, Canada.[11] One book of which Iserbyt was critical, “Schooling for a Global Age”, edited by Charlotte C. Anderson, James M. Becker, Institute for Development of Educational Activities, New York 1979, Iserbyt cited as having less to do with fostering learning and mainly to do with psychological manipulation of students, possibly against the teaching of the child’s parents, for example, in arts classes.[12]”

You see in Charlotte world, it is the politics of left and right that are dumbing down education in America and across the globe. She outlines and provides the evidence to support her premise. She too, walks the middle that speaks of the diversity and non-conformity of the parents. Meanwhile it is the smiling educators and reformers of high political and social capital who want parents, students and communities to conformed and complied with the hidden and overt agendas of the two star attractions, enemies to each other and yet after the same crowd, to convinced the parents, students and communities to hopped on their vision train called Inspiring Education, Education Excellence or 21st century learning. The names change, but not the aged old tactics used throughout the centuries to control the actions and behaviours of those they served.

” How can intelligent people argue simultaneously that   teachers cannot do the simple task of teaching yet they can keep political/power hungry wolves at bay?  How does such incompetence in the classroom lead to so much efficacy on the political landscape?”  Mirka, if you can’t answer the questions you posed, perhaps you need to go back to school and learned the knowledge in the history books. That is if the history has not been revised to suit those who are presently in power. Last time I check, one can do a lousy job but hang unto his job because he is well-placed as having high political and social capital.

What is even more amusing, Mirka’s narrative is all about retaining and maintaining the political clout and authority of the K to 12 education establishment, while pretending to be enemies of the reformers, private corporations and others outside of the education system that dares to come to the table changing the status-quo of the K to 12 education system. There has to be a war, to get the emotions rile up for the students, parents and the communities. To get them marching to the private agendas of both fractions, and becoming cheerleaders for one or both fractions.

The only bright spot the parents are acting like they have in the historical past dating back to ancient times, walking down the middle trying to avoid the smiling faces that often don’t speak the truth. What the education establishment have not noticed how many parents are walking down the middle. What the education establishment have notice is the symptom which has become a very hot topic for the Canadian and American K to 12 establishment and as well in the UK, that the public has low levels of public confidence in the public K to 12 system. In fact, for both Ontario and Alberta, and now BC, an important goal to regain the public confidence of the public schools.

Part 4 of 4

Public confidence is the first to go, when schools are no longer educating students with the knowledge banks, the skills and abilities to navigate in the adult world. It is getting pretty crowded in the middle. Twelve years ago it was a lonely journey of a fewer parents whose children were not well served by the schools. Today, in 2014 that is no longer the case. The diversity is amazing and from where I am sitting in a more rural setting of Canada, parents are fed up with what the schools are not providing - a solid foundation in the 3 Rs. Simple it should be in the 21st century, but no it is a complex undertaking for parents in my corner of Canada because the education establishment will only provide political ideological commentary as to the reasons why ‘Little Johnnie’ is reading two grade levels below, ‘Little Suzie’ the tween does not know her math facts, and ‘Big David’ is cutting bits and pieces of paper to understand fractions in a grade 11 math class.

I know educating children is complex, being a parent for over 35 years. However, due to all the advances in technology, advances in the cognitive and learning sciences of the 21st century, why is it the education establishment insists on using 19th century political tactics that has been refined over the years for the education of children, than expect high praise from the parents/students who are coming out of the K to 12 system with low levels of literacy, numeracy and knowledge gaps of fundamental knowledge. Why is it that it is the parents who are reteaching the classroom lessons of the day at night?  Why is it organization skills are no longer taught in today’s schools? 

Isn’t it about time the educators stopped patting themselves on their backs, and a critical analysis on the sick K to 12 education system. Just remember educators, the parents walking down the middle some are holding choice banners as a solution to get away from the smiling faces of the public K to 12 education establishment. You see parents and their children don’t have that luxury of life long learning, when the basic foundational skills are so weak. I never thought to be using my solid foundational skills in the 3 Rs and my deep general knowledge banks to do battle with school officials who could not see the obvious, my youngest child struggling in reading. Instead I heard the political reason steeped in education and pedagogy ideologies that my child had no problem in reading. And then I had to become the teacher and do what the educators refuses to do - it is not on the menu of the schools. Nor is it on the menu of any of the hidden agendas of the K to 12 education establishment.

Smiling faces….......do you get it. Back to the music intermission - Smiling Faces.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8CJZcVi5BA4

Nancy

99 parents out of 100 would look at the above and dismiss it out of hand.  We know thaf is how YOU feel. Few agree.

Doug, why is it when the education establishment, responds to criticism, they use the tactics of discrediting the sources, individuals and groups. As if parents are mere political tools to be chastised into conformity and compliance of the inner political agents of the K to 12 education establishment. Why is it, Doug and Mirka never acknowledges the content of the criticism from parents?

To acknowledge would be to admit the failings of the public K to 12 on not providing a solid education for one and all. One can’t have parents getting funny ideas that the local schools are no longer providing the education services and education that provides a solid foundation for students to learned and progress.

By the way Doug, you better get busy and dived into the Canadian K to 12 education towers of educationalists. Times are a changing, the educationalists are becoming change agents of a different stripe. Low public confidence is the big problem for the top level education theorists. The Ontario Achieving Excellence papers and the Alberta Inspiring Education papers will confirmed your worst fees.  Plans are underway, to increase the funding directed at parental engagement and to reengaged the public. One day, the educationalists realized that the public was no longer engaged or listening. An important acknowledgement by the education ministries to concede, but the only trouble the education ministries are using the teachers’ unions, school boards and education faculties to administered the medicine to keep the status-quo and to erect the false facade of strong public confidence in the public education system.

Doug, the other day I approached parents in my corner of the world.Rather funny all of them had a list of complaints regardless if the child was doing well or not. The common thread, what the schools are no longer willing to do, and it is left up to parents to provide. Parents are not at all impressed, and I am sure my little experiment can be repeated coast to coast, and one will get the same results.

We all know educators’ jobs are taxing at the best of times, but when the education forces within the K to 12 insert their political and social capital and influence within, often the resulting outcomes are at the expense of the students and their education, in order to satisfied the private agendas of the public K to 12 establishment. My child became a victim of the political ideologies of the pedagogues and education theories that will not provide a solid foundation in the 3 Rs, but are quite willing to provide the knowledge for my child to become a change agent, without have the ability to applied the knowledge of change agent because of her lower skills in the 3 Rs. Oh yes Doug, a good place to start is in the pedagogy. Lots of good stuff, that is current of transforming students starting in grade 1 into change agents. Eyebrow raising stuff when the educationalists actually expects children to advocate for themselves as change agents in charge of their own learning in the constructivist classroom. Last time I check, children are not little adults, they are children.

Have you heard the radio ad about how teachers are professionals?

Extremely interesting why somebody decided to pay advertisment fees at prime time on the radio just to say teachers are professionals. By the way, who could be paying for it?

In actual fact Nancy the education world has shifted and is now going the other way. All REFORM ideas have crashed and burned.

Just too funny our Doug is, who continues not to acknowledge that the veils of opaqueness of the K to 12 education establishment are no longer masking the hidden agendas that serves the best interests of the K to 12 educators. The public is getting a bird’s eye view from the bleachers, seeing the barriers and locks on the access doors to education services.

Europe mentions the prime time radio ad of teachers being professionals. No doubt all part of the Achieving Excellence program. Here is the ETFO contribution - “The document, Building Better Schools, to be released Wednesday, also calls on the government to limit class sizes in full-day kindergarten — some teachers have as many as 34 little kids in the room — as well as decrease the average size of Grade 4 to 8 classes, currently higher than those in the province’s secondary schools.” http://www.thestar.com/yourtoronto/education/2014/04/02/ontario_teachers_seek_smaller_class_sizes_especially_with_more_specialneeds_kids.html

One ought to read the comments pointing out the deficiencies of the K to 12 to the locked access doors to resources and education services to remembering the days when shop, home economics, art and music classes were fully equipped classrooms. and one will learned a few net bits of information, that will beg the question how will the ETFO accomplished their Building Better Schools without violating every other principle of equity and inclusiveness, while keeping the access doors locked to resources and education services.  http://buildingbetterschools.ca/

On another front, just the other day a 26 million dollar lawsuit was slapped down the desk of the Ontario Education Ministry by a big national daycare operator. Its one thing for the K to 12 education system using their political and social capital to mowed down the smaller daycare outfits, its another thing going after one of the big boys. http://www.newswire.ca/en/story/1337207/daycare-operator-sues-ontario-ministry-of-education-for-26-million

I also encounter other newer lawsuits against the Ministry of Education as well that leads me to believed that an announcement will be coming, of the hiring of a private pricey law firm to handle the overflow of education lawsuits registered against the Ministry of Education. It indicates, that parents are not happy campers by a long shot. The commentary by parents are harsh, mocking and very cynical. resulting in pushback from parents. The parents are becoming more vocal and aware of the hidden agendas of the education establishment who are working against the best interests of their children, and for a loud set of vocal parents, its all about the wasteful spending taking place.

So no, the parents are not happy campers across Canada. And yes, it is no longer lonely walking the middle trying to avoid the smiling faces of the educators - I am in good company and now the parents in my corner of Canada, has got themselves a party. When a parent phones up a radio talk show, nine times out of ten, the parent is about to revealed the latest outrage being released by the education hound dogs. However the real miracle is, parents are being paid attention rather than dismissing them straight off and than defend the public education K to 12. News media and radio talk hosts are less inclined to defend the the Public K to 12, and would rather discussed the deficits of the public K to 12, what is working and not working and why do grade 12 graduates entering college are taking remedial courses on stuff that should have been taught way back in elementary school, but was not.

And now in Ontario parents to get here all about the professionalism of teachers while dealing with the fallout of their children’s low academic grades. The cognitive dissonance must be hurting the minds trying to squared the true reality and surreal alternative reality of the K to 12.

Nancy - part one of four??????

If teachers were the dead beats that Bev describes we could if we chose read a four part diatribe.  But it is Friday night and I have some serious marking to do- Chemistry.

Nancy, I never read posts that start with part one of three etc - it suggests a real lack of discipline and an enormous amount of time.  Neither of which are a fit for this educator.

you do make it so easy,

Mirka

Bev has never called educators deadbeats. However Mirka, at every opportunity you do make disparaging references to the opponents’ intelligence and knowledge banks. What Mirka, will never comment on is the actual content of the posts….....

Mirka, so what if you’re marking chemistry papers on a Friday night.  High school teachers are in the classroom fewer than half the number of days/annum, plus you’re only in the classroom teaching for three and a half hours/day.  Frankly, there is no comparison between the hours/annum a teacher works and what the private sector works:  in the private sector you’d be deemed, part-time.  What would your salary be in the private sector as a part-time employee with a bsc in chemistry?  I know—do you?
I shall gripe further:  the semester system has resulted in whole units in the maths and sciences to be scrapped.  If your profession cares so much about our children, and are talented organizers (as you claim) then why aren’t you and the other educators spending the other half of the year that you don’t work reforming our educational system for the benefit of the children and making it accountable to taxpayers? 

Back to the original subject matter in this blog:  teachers and all public servants should receive salaries and benefits no higher nor lower than what people who have the same educational background earn in the private sector.  When public servants are paid more and receive better benefits than the workers private sector, this simply isn’t fair:  why should one sector of society receive more than another person who has the education/skills?  It’s not social justice.  Teachers, don’t despair.  If/when this comes about (our province is broke so it could happen)  you’d still get an enormous amount of time off, which a huge perk—especially for the ones of you who have children! 

Bev,

Teachers *are* paid commensurate to their education and skill set.

Please see:

http://www.fin.gov.on.ca/en/publications/salarydisclosure/pssd/

Nancy,

I have stopped commenting on the* content* on your posts - as I DO NOT READ THEM.  I used to but the quality of the writing does not justify the investment in time.

Mirka, no one really cares what you read and don’t read—honestly, you can keep it to yourself

Teachers along with all psu employees earn far more in salaries, benefits, and pensions that if fail the taxpayer will cover.  When tbe taxpayer is forced to pay for someone else (teachers and all other psu employees plus bloated bureaucracy) to live better than they do, this is not social justice.
You supposedly teach social justice in the classroom, however you don’t practise it.
btw, thanks for the website.  I didn’t read it.

Bev,

the web site, I posted,  is critical to inform your arguments/position.  I was not surprised that you declined to expand your horizons.

You appear really bitter about what psu earn.  I expect because you fall short.  There are no victims just volunteers.  Happily your children are out of the system -  so why the rage - why the rage daily?  It is simply not healthy. 

Dissonance - an excellent teacher.

Mirka

what nonsence, Mirka.  Some article is not going to convince me of anything tbat isn’t true.

So Mirka is under the impression that the list for Ontario’s $100,000 plus salary club is of use. Perhaps, Mirka could expand her own horizons, and look upon SQE’s Sunshine on Schools data. Who knows, Mirka may be able to shine light on some data, that may be a pause for thinking. In the same way I did, shining a light on the $100,000 plus salary club, It led me to a big dark cave, that is not seen too often by the public and parents with children who have special eduction concerns. But first what I gleam from Mirka’s link….

There is 93 Educational Psychologists making approximately, on average about $108,000. Yes, I thought it was below considering the education levels one needs to have the qualifications to assess, interpreted the results and file reports. I counted only 4 making salaries from 129,000 to 139.000. As for the rest, all fall under the 120,000 mark with the majority under $110,000. Due to the my Dark Cave adventure this morning, I can now add that 93 Educational Psychologists comprised 21 % of the total number of educational psychologists throughout Ontario.

Now my numbers were gathered on my way to the dark cave that has not seen any sunlight for a very long time, There is no one place, because of the networks within networks. However as I was gathering the numbers, I came upon a few web pages that led me to the dark cave. The name of the branch - Special Education Policy and Programs Branch.  On the Info-Go page - the only description I could find - “The primary functions of the Special Education Policy and Programs Branch are to: support the educational achievement of students with special needs through evidenced-based policies; liaise with a wide range of stakeholders/educational partners to identify issues requiring policy responses; provide expertise to other branches of the ministry to… and ensure horizontal policy integration for interministry policy initiatives that are aimed at serving children and youth with special education needs. ”  http://www.infogo.gov.on.ca/infogo/office.do?actionType=servicedirectory&infoType=service&unitId=UNT0018710&locale=en

No web site. Although I managed to dig up the director and his staff - http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=5&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CEwQFjAE&url=http://www.macse-on.ca/uploads/MACSE_Minutes_October_10_and_11_2012_ENG.pdf&ei=oNNLU_KnEsXZ2QXO-IBI&usg=AFQjCNHk9QTckMb58SqR0KhswWxSJbSMfw&sig2=77mhGJb_zYsS_xOptx9hKw&bvm=bv.64542518,d.b2I

Some of the major players, and I just need to connect the dots to the networks within networks. It is going to take me days to connect the names to the networks to the ongoing policies and initiatives that parents see on the ground. The operation and administration system is designed to limit access to SE services, but more importantly to limit access to the educational remediation in the 3Rs. I am stating it upfront, I have yet to confirmed my statements, but I am 90 % sure that my premises will be confirmed.

Just a peek of 2 pieces of evidence - one - “Current Special Education research is informed by the pedagogical philosophy of John Abbot, president of the 21st Century Learning Initiative”  http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=6&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CHsQFjAF&url=http://www.edu.gov.on.ca/eng/research/speced_gap_paper.pdf&ei=db5LU-SyOMi22AXWg4CIBA&usg=AFQjCNEbrxUv1jwtSBl3eFS0D8-XGK25pA&sig2=_vzKEhzJH7MU-bGeBvxW4g&bvm=bv.64542518,d.b2I

My, the upper crust of the education establishment sure loves to make classroom educators jobs very taxing. Oh well, perhaps Mirka could shine a light on the radical pedagogy of John Abbot, and connect it to the low achievement of SE students.

The other piece of evidence, also produces more stress and taxing work for the classroom educators. Again, Mirka could shine some light on this area, but according to mantra of the teachers’ unions, parents are happy and contented campers. Really?  Correspondence to the director of Special Education Policy and Programs Branch from the Centre for ADHD Awareness, Canada - http://www.caddac.ca/cms/page.php?177  Barry Finlay of SEPPB, is attached to multiple files across the span of the K to 12. My image of him, being the head guy approving the SE programs, rubber stamping approved or not approved. The not approved are the initiatives that would give the SE students a running chance to get out of the bottom achievers and into competition with the top achievers.

As Bev has stated, “You supposedly teach social justice in the classroom, however you don’t practice it.” I will add, neither does the Education Ministry and their partners practice social justice by applying the principles of non-discriminatory practices. Its all about keeping the SE access doors locked isn’t it Mirka? One of the outcomes is it makes the classroom educators’ jobs a lot more taxing. Oops I forgot taxing jobs in exchange for summers off and lots of perks.

OK, Mirka, I have read through the site; it simply discloses who makes what in Ontario’s public sector.  I’ll reiterate my point:  the public sector, on average, makes more in salaries, benefits and pensions than people in the private sector who have equal education/skills.  This practice is unfair so the public sector needs to be in line with the private sector who are paying the bills, and until this happens, we won’t have social justice.

The Sunshine list is useless since it does not grow with infkation.

If private sector workers want more money they need to unionize and create a bigger stink.

The whole point of govt paying higher wages is to create labour shortages in the private sector causing wages to rise.

Doug, your statement is so twisted:  the public sector is negotiating because they want to have more job security, much higher wages, lighter workloads, more time off, and very lucrative pensions (and if the pensions fail, the taxpayers shore them up).  This has nothing to do with helping the private sector—it only increases taxes.

Why is the plumbers union that employs mostly private sector plumbers very happy that public sector plumbers make more? Because private employers will lose their good workers to the public sector unless they also pay more give pensions benefits to match public. As a result the standard of living of the whole nation raised. High wages = high standard of living.

Workers do not want the public workers dragged backwards. They want to rise with them as the public workers blaze the trail.

Yah, Doug, but you’re talking about the members of the Family Coalition. 
btw, oftentimes, unions have driven small businesses into bankruptcy.

Companies that can’t pay scale have no inherent right to be in business.  .

Is that why a big Daycare operator is suing the Ontario Education Ministry for $126 million dollars. Is that the new line of the radical educators - if they can’t pay scale, they have no inherent right to be in business?  Perhaps what was done to the small daycare operators, the radical educators thought it could be done to the big daycare operators. With attitudes like Doug, radical educators will soon be real busy defending their fuzzy, illogical and anti-rights philosophy in the courts of the land.

Bev,

Thank you for reading the link.  And thank you for making the connections.

LOVE my union.  They do the heavy lifting so that I can focus on my students.

LOVE my union.

Mirka