It is estimated that around 20% of kids are ‘dyslexic’.  Some estimates say 30%.

only 1% or less have true dyslexia, the rest haven’t been properly taught to read. (Torgensen 2001).

But we hire specialist teachers and psychologists to diagnose the rest and we don’t spent time teaching them phonics.  The result is a tsunami of LD kids. 

Educational malpractice.  Bring back phonics and it will subside (and we can fire the do-nothing specialists).

BCTF officials make far less than Ontario officials. The #of teachers does not affect their wages but naturally more teachers = more officials eventually.

https://www.bctf.ca/

There have been many parents with LD kids who, quite frankly, are astounded that their kids are being used in this debate stating they’re the reason why the public system is broken.  They have every right to be there, and quite frankly, are insulted that their kids are being singled out as why we now have job action in this province.  Here’s something to consider:  if we had proper teacher training at colleges, and classroom resources that actually fit the child, we wouldn’t have as many learning problems in the classroom that we do today. 

A friend of mine here has 2 LD kids, one minor, one more severe.  In the past, she has asked that specific resources, i.e. JUMP Math, be used for her daughter, as it would help with her learning disability and make her understand the math component of the curriculum.  And JUMP Math, by the way, is on the approved list of resources for LD kids in BC.  Problem was, the teacher didn’t like JUMP Math as a resource and refused to use it for her daughter.  So daughter gets yanked from that school due to her inability to follow along, and now parents are spending thousands of dollars annually to put her in a private school.  One less kid for the BCTF to promote, and one more reason why these particular issues of the strike need to be examined.

The BCTF loves to prop up class size and composition for why the public system here in BC is broken. My own personal experience is very different.  We had a tremendous Grade 5 teacher several years ago who taught 29 kids (19 of which were boys) using free resources off the internet and taught her daily lessons with both discipline and humour.  She was incredibly inspiring, and still remains my kids’ favourite teacher to this day.

Sorry to hog the microphone here folks, I just wanted to shed a bit of light on where the real issues lie, and it’s in stark contrast being played out in the media.

For alternative POV.

http://issuu.com/teachernewsmag/docs/fairdealforteachers

One recurring theme in the reform movement is the very high number of parents of SE kids.

Many of these parents believe that the job of the SE program is to catch their child up to the rest. The system however believe that its job is to maximize the child’s potential. There is a gap in these 2 perceptions leading to a great deal of anguish.

Parents believe their child’s potential is much higher than the system seems to believe.

Many SE parents demand much higher and much more specific services than a large system is prepared to deliver.

SE is staggeringly expensive. 8/1 ratios the main thing. As a result mainstreaming is sought for most of the mild-medium cases with possible booster classes.

The SE kids in regular classes often slow lessons to a crawl.

This actually removes service from non-SE kids.

There is a critical mass of SE kids a class can handle before it becomes dysfunctional for everybody.

This is complex but involves both general class size and # of SE kids.

Of course some will say Ms Jones did a good job why not Mr Brown.

This is like telling a team of hockey players ” everybody go out there tonight and play like Sidney Crosby” where is the problem.

Something has to give and BC teachers are totally fed up working far harder and being paid far less than other provincial comrades.

Many parents especially SE parents seem to be saying I want a higher level of service for my child but the system does not need more money and the tax payers do not have to pay more to schieve this.

It just doesn’t work like that.

“Many parents especially SE parents seem to be saying I want a higher level of service for my child but the system does not need more money and the tax payers do not have to pay more to schieve this.”

Honestly Doug, what about those resources that don’t cost ANYTHING to provide yet are being ignored because teachers don’t like them?  I do not know of any parents with LD kids asking for additional resources that cost anymore than the current resources being already utilized in classrooms.  There are more free and under utilized resources for these kids than ever before, but there is not will in the classroom to use them.  Why is that?  As Tom alludes to in his first post, the kids with actual Dyslexia is far less than the broad scope likes to report on.  But organizations like the BCTF like to hone in on these stats because it means more $$ for their organization.  The bigger issue is that the foundational skills aren’t being taught properly, because teaching methods are ineffective in the classroom, and that is something which needs to change.  By the way, the BCCPAC (provincial parent advisory board) announced their action plan today.  Instead of focusing on the “class size and composition” issue, they are focusing on better resources for kids in the classroom.  This is something parents can become a part of, and have a stronger voice at the bargaining table.

Parent advisory councils hold emergency meeting | Watch News Videos Online

Aaaaaaand once again the education system is not an a la carte menu where you choose your own curriculum and pedagogy.

Look at my first post Doug…teachers are ignoring approved resources set out by the Ministry.

So what Tara. As long as the materials they DO use are approved it is simply not your call.

It is absolutely the call of the parents to ask for approved resources to be used in the classroom Doug if the existing resources are NOT working.  What makes this incredibly maddening, is that the teacher outright refused the approved resource, sending yet another frustrated family.  Tell me exactly what the benefit of that is?  Is it the position of the BCTF to stand behind a teacher which refuses to acknowledge approved, meaningful resources for a child just because this teacher felt like it?

As long as taxpayers are funding this system, it IS my call to ensure every appropriate measure is taken to so that children can continue to learn effectively in the classroom.  That is why we have standards and lists of resources to be used in the classroom.  No wonder so many frustrated parents are turning away from the system.

Oh you can ASK for anything you want. You are not the deciders.

We have free speech but we have professional decision making.

When you don’t like it you talk to the boards and the Premier.

You dont get to tell classroom teachers what to do or what to use.

Doug,

  By your two responses above to Tara, I am guessing that education is an “a la carte menu” but only for the teachers?

  I think that is the crux of the issue here where we seem to be having a discussion where excuses become solutions. I agree fully (almost) with your post above where you say “Many of these parents believe that the job of the SE program is to catch their child up to the rest. The system however believe that its job is to maximize the child’s potential. There is a gap in these 2 perceptions leading to a great deal of anguish.” and the issues that you describe that having having SE in a class can cause.

    The problem is, in my opinion, that it is the duty of Professional Educators to move more towards the Parental side of the “gap”. When a child entering grade one gets the response of the educational establishment- to that child’s inability to hold a pencil properly- is to suggest that he be put on program for the rest of his education that would allow him to do all his work on a keyboard, there is a serious disconnect. Why try to show him how to hold a pencil (or read) when you can code him? I take that as being Tara’s and Tom’s point. As Hattie says in this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3pD1DFTNQf4 (at approx. 3:54) on dyslexia “I can fix that”.

    I think most parents (and taxpayers) would vote for more money in a heartbeat if it was going to help! I think what many of us balk at is the trickle-down economics philosophy of the unions: “Ship us a boatload of money and some teachers might spend some of their new-found time to sometimes help some of the children”. Are BC teachers underpaid? Maybe! But that has little to do with the welfare of the children.

The CD Howe study found that paying teachers more works. Where teachers are paid more and other factors are constant results are better.

I can bury you in class size research that shows it makes a difference. Since Canada has done some of both we have the world’s most educated population.

The problems is that some students have intellectual problems that limit their futures and some parents are unwilling to accept thatm

Tara-Nick-

The teachers graduate from special ed level 1 and 2 without a clue how to remediate the problems in students who struggle to learn to read and spell.There is a mountain of research on the core deficits and we know how to fix it,3-6 months and the problem with reading and spelling is gone.
It`s akin to a child with an infection not getting a prescription for an antibiotic.
For those of us who watch..it`s a nightmare,for those of us who watch our children,it`s a catastrophe.

All they have to do is listen to the research…however,the world of academic research is the most dog eat dog milieu you can imagine…they want to reinvent the wheel and get published.
The kids are NOT on the agenda..you sit,you watch,you listen,the noise is denser and denser and the kids further and further from the solution.
The educators don`t give a $%^&* nor do the researchers…

Therefore,without the discerning knowledge,they shop with the publishers who are allowed to peddle snake oil.

Of course class size and teacher’s pay makes a difference but how much and how much does it cost? Are there better ways to spend the money?

Hattie has class size at a very small effect size and a huge cost. Is that best for the students? How much are the unions fighting for some of the things that really work? How about making the system more accountable? My issue is the “it’s all about the children” slogans when it obviously isn’t. To be fair, I don’t accept the line from the departments of education when they use it to pummel the unions either.

As to the last comment about parents not being able to accept their child’s limitations, that may be. Patients in hospitals die as well but doctors (and staff) still don’t just write them off the moment they come in the door. Do you have any issue with children being coded instead of helped? Is there anything that can be done to help them?

I have been busy crunching the numbers. Doug is holding the union position that the Ministry of Education and other conspirators such as parents are the ones to be blame for the high number of SE students in the classrooms. The BC K to 12 SE population represents 10 % of the 558,985 student population. The SE population has remained relatively flat in and around the 10 % mark since 2001. The SE 10 % number also holds true at the school board and school levels. The favorite whipping boy is and always has been are the SE students, when it comes to contract negotiations.  http://www.bced.gov.bc.ca/reporting/province.php

Composition of the 68,020 K to 12 classes – 3 or less students with IEPs – 51, 857 or 76%
                                              - 4 or more students with IEP – 16,163 or 24 %
http://www.bced.gov.bc.ca/reports/pdfs/class_size/2013/public.pdf
Both sides are complicit in hiding the true composite numbers for the average classroom. On average, at least 63 % of the classrooms are dealing with zero SE students to one or two SE students. At least 13 % of the classrooms are dealing with 3 SE students. Another 9 % of classrooms for 4 SE students, 6 % of classrooms for 5 SE students,  4% of classrooms for 6 SE students and 5 % of classrooms for 7 or greater SE students. Is the BCTF staying on the picket line for 10 % of the student population?  What students are they talking about if not the SE students?  The 43 % of non-SE students who have low reading, writing and numeracy skills. The number starts off small in the primary grades, but quickly starts to add up in the elementary and high school years based on the achievement data. Where I estimate at least 50 % of the grade 12 graduates are walking out of grade 12 with low literacy and numeracy skills.

As Tara has stated, “The bigger issue is that the foundational skills aren’t being taught properly, because teaching methods are ineffective in the classroom, and that is something which needs to change.”  Unfortunately Tara, both the BCTF and the Education Ministry are not about change, because it does not served their agendas, and hence the SE students comprising 10 % of the student population become the political pawns that sets the stage for the ideological war underway in BC. The only small silver lining is the $40 per day if the strike continues after September 2, and parents hopefully will realize that it is the teaching methods and curriculum of the schools that are ineffective and not their children.

Jo-Anne,

  That has been my experience as well. My child was a success (so far). My wife and I got involved and, at the end of the year, he is now writing above grade level. Was the teacher the problem? No! He/she cares about the children under his/her charge and is very professional- the going above and beyond type and worked with us and came up with a system- with minimum effort- that worked. It was interesting how quickly it snowballed! No serious improvement for a couple of months and the amazing improvement in just a few weeks (as you said). Biggest change? A change of administration from the “I have this grand philosophical/ideological plan that will make a name for me and everything else is secondary” to “lets do what works for the kids”. That simple! I just shudder to think what would have happened if we had signed off on the coding at the start and I don’t blame the teacher for that (just “following orders” I think). I am more concerned (for the time being) with what happens to my child’s classmates, friends and future co-workers (and voters).

    Doug is a union man- and I think unions are good- but I want to understand why he seems to approve of this perverse incentive system? A teacher who is awake at night worrying about their students? Well you will get less than someone who has stopped caring but was born earlier… Unless the union gets you your 2% increase. What to make big money? Get ahead? Subject students to all sorts of ill-researched “snake-oil” until you become the area “guru”... Maybe write a text book? Perhaps you can even teach teachers as long as you want to “revolutionize the system”! Big money there!  Caring about the students shouldn’t be a deficit… It shouldn’t be working extra for free. How much extra money would be freed up for front-line teachers if the bloated administration ranks weren’t siphoning it off for vanity projects?  My child’s school has no money for a french teacher (union job) but has the money to change the library into a “learning commons” that nobody asked for. I would have thought that parents like myself and union members like Doug would be natural allies. I guess that, as long as “You dont get to tell classroom teachers what to do or what to use.” that will not be the case.

Nick I do hope you realize when speaking in terms of parents not being able to accept their child’s limitations, in the K to 12 education circles is a tactic used since the dawn of the 20th century to keep parents aligned with the lower expectations of the K to 12 establishment. Thomas Edison who was six,  came home with a note pined to his shirt written by teacher - Thomas is too stupid to learn. The parents thought otherwise, and Thomas was homeschooled. The rest of the story everyone knows.

The writing off students begins in grade one. The vast majority of LD students, formally and non-formally identified are written off by the K to 12 as being non-academic. Lots of adjectives are used. The most common one is a slow learner. My own child, like other parents who start to pushed for an assessment to test for learning disabilities are usually denied the assessment request with the upgrade from slow learner to developmentally slow.

So yes children are coded by the K to 12, but regardless if the children are coded or not, the children with difficulties in the 3 Rs are not getting any effective help from the K to 12. It is left up to the parents, in the same way Thomas Edison’s parents was, to obtained the effective help for their children, because it sure won’t be the K to 12 crowd. In the BC Education stats, only 0.6 % of the SE population received As to Bs in the 12 English course, having 68,315 students taking the course.
http://www.bced.gov.bc.ca/reports/pdfs/exams/req/prov.pdf

Listen to Joanne. She sees it daily in her work when visiting schools. As a parent I see it as low expectations by the K to 12 crowd, but in reality it is all about the questionable teacher training and development.

Hi I will write more later.  Tom there are far more children that are Dyslexic than one percent.  We have 3 in our house of 4.