Agenda show featured Chris Stockwell (PC) Caplan (LIB) and Peter Kormos (NDP). All 3 agreed that none of this will happen because it is not politiclly possible for any party including the PCs.

Time for a tax increase.

Quite the stirring of the bee’s nest.

Special education - and the recommendations of tying student achievement progress to the education services being provided - about time.

How many SE kids are spinning their wheels, doing work two grade levels below, because their learning deficits are not being remediated effectively to where they are doing grade level work?

I also like the recommendation of closing down the demonstration schools for learning disabilities, and having the boards to take over.

” The Commission believes that the Ontario Public Service is not the optimal governance arrangement for these schools. Alternative programming in school boards should be considered instead of Demonstration Schools for students with learning disabilities; this would allow students to live with their families. Schools for the deaf need a critical mass to offer a wide range of programs and services, especially at the secondary panel, yet enrolment has declined significantly; these schools should be consolidated.”
http://www.fin.gov.on.ca/en/reformcommission/chapters/ch6.html#ch6-k

After reviewing one of the LD schools, I have a question how many LD students actually qualifies to attend the school. The LD and ADHD spectrum runs across the spectrum, where 80 % or so in both categories are mild to moderate. The LD demonstration schools, are only serving 20 percent of the LD and ADHD, and when one considers the criteria, the 20 percent have been reduced to 15 percent.

http://www.psbnet.ca/eng/schools/sagonaska/index.html

Furthermore, severe LD or ADHD students, the program is for one year only.  My child who falls on the mild to moderate line in LD, if I had the opportunity and money to send her to a LD school, I know it would require 2 years, to addressed her learning deficits. What will one year do for students progress and the necessary remediation?  Where there is vouchers in the United States, the mild to moderate LD students the average stay for 2 years at a LD school, and than renters the regular education system. For severe at the minimum, a 4 year stay.

Close them down, and start to provide for all LD students in the remediation of the 3 Rs, and as suggested in the Drummond report, provide alternative programming that actually addressed the difficulties in the 3 Rs.  And not just the 20 percent of LD students.

I also tried to locate stats on the LD demonstration schools, no luck. What are they hiding, and my next question, why isn’t the LD parents and its community, touting about the LD schools?  Or do they think it is a waste of money, that could be better spent at the board level?  As a parent, I can see why the Drummond report is recommending closure of the demonstration schools for good reasons.

I posted a post here earlier challenging the union spin to the Drummond recommendations.

I assume it did not pass the mustard yet, yesterday when Doretta was on Jerry Agar’s show the union spin DID come up.

Again today Agar rightly identified the old union canard, kneejerk reaction to Drummond’s recommendation as union spin, something which in the very first post to this issue is done by Doug.

It IS a tactic that the public will no longer tolerate, but one that the McGuinty gov’t might just be sucked in to yet again. Not like he hasn’t gone this route before.

Public opinion, no doubt, is split on some issues, but not others.  I remind readers to take a look at our poll question on all-day JK/SK. 

It certainly will be interesting to see what the next budget holds in light of the Drummond report.

In the famous British comedy “Yes Minister” whenever the chief bureaucrat wanted to warn the Minister of impending suicide he would respond to the Minister’s qhestions about a policy direction by saying “That course would take courage Mr Minister…” with the full understanding that the minister’s understanding of courage was a huge loss of votes, peerhaps enough to lose the government.

The reps of the 3 parties on Agenda were saying in unison, “That would take courage Mr McGuinty” Stockwell the PC rep said “no government can do this, not even a PC government.”

It is political suicide for sure.

Michael Decter the next night said, “The Liberal were elected by forming a coalition of their existing party with the public sector nurses, teachers and doctors. Saying no to them ends the coalition and ends the support for the government. Chris Stockwell said the benefit will go to the NDP because the PCs will be demanding more compliance than McGuinty can stomach.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yeF_o1Ss1NQ 

followed by this

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0DIy-C4cQ-M

“The clash between the political ‘will’ and the administrative ‘won’t’”

in the case of Drummond, visa versa (latin )

It’s funny and too true

Yes, exactly Doretta. The general public has no patience left for the bully tactics of the unions on this. That “tax increase” tactic is nothing but union bullying by usual suspects.

New poll out today by Forum says no desire by Ontario public for cuts, Liberal voters in particular do not support Drummond direction.

Hudak least popular leader, Horwath most popular by far.

Looks like Dalton is stuck nibbling around the edges and raising taxes.

Tommy Douglas who never ran a deficit in Sask used to say “a deficit is a clear sign that taxes are too low.”

The tax cuts of the last 10 years = the deficit just like in the USA.

That said, I do support a few Drummond recommendations. There are far too many kids in SE. The worst offender is Gifted. I would set a 140 IQ test and if you are 139 too bad. Forget all the Howard Gairdner junk about multiple intelligence.

I would eliminate French Immersion and move towards a universal “extended French” model. No busing needed.

Native education is terribly underfunded, a national disgrace really.

I said from the very start FDK is very expensive so why not just for the bottom half of SES or reading scores, I don’t care which since they are the same schools.

Same argument with class sizes. Drummond want to raise 20 to 23.

Why not leave 20 for bottom half and 26 for the top half?

Cut back on numbers and raise teacher quality? Sure, use Finnish model must have MA to apply, overnight no problem.

The Forum poll, is a mixed bag, Doug.

And the Liberals are in a difficult spot.

Can’t wait until the next budget, to see the many user fees raining down upon the Ontarians.

http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/politics/article/1132774—ontarians-not-eager-for-drummond-s-harsh-medicine-of-public-service-cuts-poll-suggests#article

This is from Wente’s column in the G&M this morning.
There is no one in their right mind who would continue in this unsustainable way, and continue to pay more for less. Way less.

Doug’s just following union mantra and the whole “it’s going to hurt the kids” routine is falling flat.

“Education – the Premier’s pet portfolio – provides a snapshot of the challenge. Mr. McGuinty’s aim for education was to buy labour peace and improve outcomes. Noble goals, providing you can contain costs. Ontario did not. Over the past decade, student enrolment shrank by 6 per cent, but education staff grew by 24,000. Most of those are non-teaching jobs. The combination of increased funding and declining enrolment means that per-pupil funding has soared by 56 per cent – from $7,201 to $11,207. Special education funding alone went up by $893-million, or 55 per cent. Fourteen per cent of Grade 12 students spend an extra year in Grade 12 – for free. Teachers’ entitlements include up to six months of unused sick days when they retire. Teachers’ retirement benefits will have to be reduced. And so on.

Not surprisingly, teachers unions have already started to bite back. The Ontario Secondary School Teachers’ Federation has pronounced the recommendations “extremely confrontational,” and warns that if implemented, they will do irreparable harm to our children.”

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/opinions/margaret-wente/can-dalton-mcguinty-morph-into-mr-mean/article2342608/

From M. Wente’s column today -  the public has no stomach for continuing to pay more for less, and no amount of union spin (see Doug’s post above) will work…including the old stand-by of suggesting that students will suffer.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/opinions/margaret-wente/can-dalton-mcguinty-morph-into-mr-mean/article2342608/

“Education – the Premier’s pet portfolio – provides a snapshot of the challenge. Mr. McGuinty’s aim for education was to buy labour peace and improve outcomes. Noble goals, providing you can contain costs. Ontario did not. Over the past decade, student enrolment shrank by 6 per cent, but education staff grew by 24,000. Most of those are non-teaching jobs. The combination of increased funding and declining enrolment means that per-pupil funding has soared by 56 per cent – from $7,201 to $11,207. Special education funding alone went up by $893-million, or 55 per cent. Fourteen per cent of Grade 12 students spend an extra year in Grade 12 – for free. Teachers’ entitlements include up to six months of unused sick days when they retire. Teachers’ retirement benefits will have to be reduced. And so on.

Not surprisingly, teachers unions have already started to bite back. The Ontario Secondary School Teachers’ Federation has pronounced the recommendations “extremely confrontational,” and warns that if implemented, they will do irreparable harm to our children.”

Don’t worry about the unions. Parents will be outraged by the report and any action McGuinty takes. The Forum poll shows already Ontarians would much rather raise taxes than cut programs.

Northern parents pay for busing ya right, paid busing for SE, FI, good luck, paying for victory lap credits, don’t make me laugh.

Cutback on FDK ya parents will love to see half get it but not their school. Raise class size, good luck with that. Anyone who would listen to CD Howe on that issue is not that bright.

Wait for the attack on pensions if you thought the Harris “green ribbon days” and strikes and demonstrations had a negative effect you have not seen anything.

Dalton knows right now his coalition with teachers, nurses, doctors and PS workers is over is he tries any of this. With it goes the future of the OLP, As it goes down the fate of the LPC is at stake.

Any attempt to impliment the plan is the end of Liberalism.

Tories= go for it
NDP = don’t even think about it
Liberals = um, er, um,er,  um, ?????

Not surprisingly, teachers unions have already started to bite back. The Ontario Secondary School Teachers’ Federation has pronounced the recommendations “extremely confrontational,” and warns that if implemented, they will do irreparable harm to our children.”

We hardly need the unions Chuck, Annie Kidder is on every TV station saying children will suffer. She is seen by the entire media as the voice of parents.

the Forum poll holds no water. Jon Wright said so. The questions badly torqued and leading.

Oh, and who commissioned that poll Doug? Certainly not any organization looking to spin in their direction ‘eh sport?

From what I read, parents are not outrage, but are worried about the increases in taxes, the cost of living, and the bread and butter issues that impacts them directly. But like other average taxpayers, are now questioning the actions of the provincial government in the last 8 years, and the Drummond report adds more evidence to support the fears of the taxpayers.

“They require fundamental reforms to deeply entrenched work practices and rigid professional boundaries. Every affected group – all the public-sector workers in the province, to say nothing of seniors with their Lipitor prescriptions – will fight like cornered rats to protect their turf. No appeals to the broader public interest will persuade them to sacrifice what Mr. Drummond says they must. Besides, if kindergarten is exempt, then why not them?”

The candy has to go, and the wider public beyond the public sector knows it.

““The built-in bias for the status quo reflects the reality that the various parts of government are understood, defended and changed mainly by those who benefit from their existence,” wrote economics writer Robert Samuelson. “What’s sacrificed is the broader public good.”

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/opinions/margaret-wente/can-dalton-mcguinty-morph-into-mr-mean/article2342608/

I highly doubt that the public sector unions, will be able to get the public on side, except for an issue here and there, but there will be no sympathy from the public, nor from parents when it comes to public sector salaries, benefits and pensions.

From a have province to a have-not province to the rust belt of Confederation…..............

http://www.peopleforeducation.ca/wp-content/uploads/2012/02/People-for-Education-media-release-reaction-to-the-Drummond-report.pdf

The P4E report on the Drummond report, is a recap of the same talking points of the teachers’ union.

No surprise there, nor the responses of calling for the status-quo and hiking the taxes.

Cherry picking the report, as if all the recommendations were being done on the backs of children.

The unions only have to inform the Liberals that the cohabitation is over and they will be joining with Andrea Horwath and the Dippers. The Liberals know this means they are finished. Believe me these conversations are already happening and the unions are promising a scorched earth policy.

Now here’s a poll you can take to the bank, and it shows contrary to what Doug and Person for Education are spinning.

http://www.angus-reid.com/polls/44400/a-third-of-canadians-perceive-country-leaning-to-the-right/

Can someone tell me how children will suffer if teachers don’t get unused sick leave payouts when they retire?  Just wondering.

Since the discussion was going nowhere but to the usual places and beginning to flout Malkin’s rules, the comments are now closed for this post.

To the commenter who sent a wave of new traffic to our website, thank you! and this one is for you too:
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