You can stop worrying. Canada has the world’s highest rate of
post-secondary completion kn the world by far. The only nation over 50%. The OECD says the only single school based way for us to improve is a universal public ECE system nation wide.

I agree.

The educators were right. The non-educators were wrong.

It is as simple as that.

If educators believe that Ontario’s school system is good, then either their focus is not on academics or they are in complete denial. 

Again, the only responisbility of our school system is to educate and when the educational system is failing to properly educate our children, anything else that they do is useless, and not their job.

You can continue living in la-la land.

Graduating high school in Ontario means nothing because a kid can graduate high school and not be able to read and fill in an application.
He graduatet but is not able to balance a budget because the can’t do the math although he have a good attitude towards math and he believes he’s good at math.
He graduated but you cannot count on him to show up on time or complete a task on time because whether he completed his assignments or not did not matter in high school.
That’s why most of them are unemployable only with high school and that’s why when they go on to university they fail and drop out at a rate of 20-40%.

Keep the empty words sprouting .. that’s all they are empty words. No contact with reality.

I’m working with a young man who ‘earned’ his high school diploma.  Only trouble is that he can’t read, and can’t do simple math.  Nothing wrong with him, but he got passed from grade to grade, sitting quietly in the back of classrooms without learning a thing.

Mom was poor and had other problems, dad was missing.  He has always had IEP’s, he has had psycho-ed assessments, his Mom desperately tried to get help for him but clearly he never received any.  He’s a well-behaved kid - quiet and respectful, exactly the kind of kid that’s easy to ignore.  He’s also pretty smart, but he couldn’t teach himself how to read. 

I’ve got him reading Goosebumps (grade 3 reading level), hope to keep him moving forward.

Tell me again what a great job our schools are doing.  Especially the part about ‘equity’.

There has never been a time in Canadian history when more were literate and numerate. There is no nation on Earth doing better.

The point is not graduation Tom. Was it from the university level? I doubt that very much. SE parents have demanded that schools have a pathway to graduation no matter how weak the student was or they would dropout. The system has accommodated for many decades with other pathways.

For anybody who might read this .. just so you know the context ..

Mr. Doug Little is a fervent supporter of our excellent public school system because the system produces competent students.
Mr. Doug is against testing and exit exams because they do not reflect real knowledge.

Mr Doug is the owner of a private high school that continues to exist despite of not being needed. It seems that there are a lot of stupid people around that just want to throw money away and instead of sending their regular, able, fully normal children to an excelent public school prefer to pay tuition to Mr. Doug’s school.

Mr. Doug, let’s assume for a brief moment that I agreed with you that our high school students are competent since they graduate in a large percentage and our public high schools are excellent.

Surely then if for example a student is in grade 11 in the academic stream in a public high school he is a solid, competent student.
Would you admit any academic grade 11 student to enroll in your high school if he pays tuition?
If not, what criteria would you use to decide admission?

The entire reason that I continue to periodically touch down here—-in the special ether—- where the resident experts have everything sorted out is:

~ to challenge the resident experts to enter the edu reality of this decade.

~ Malkin, Doretta, Nancy, Bev, Tom and the executive of this organization,  just imagine what you could do if you actually were in the room this decade.

~ There are many mechanisms in our current edu-swamp to give smart righteous people like you a voice in the local dialogue.  But that takes tenacity and courage.  That tenacity/courage also tempers the absolutism that is often spouted here.  The real world is complicated.

Education advocates have moved the dialogue each and every year.  There are many REAL ways to engage.  The professional contributors on this blog should consider:

1.  Being a trustee
2.  Being a community member on a school council.

Get all this passion and expertise to the table and make a difference.

A difference that reflects the issue of this decade and not thirty years ago.

I am a teacher, and my wife is a teacher and we don’t think the public system is effective, or doing a good job. We have worked our entire careers in places that would send most people to drink; extreme remote fly in communities where the standard is failure and base ignorance.  All we see is an endless stream of do-gooder progressive, leftist young teachers and old socialist administrators come and go.  They all have a shiny new philosophy (next year it’s going to be Blended Learning and Play-Based experience learning) and there is no lack of money either; it flows from the government for all native communities, and big expensive (progressive) initiatives are always coming down the pipe. The only thing that stays the same is the bad behaviour, the depth of ignorance, and phoney graduations ceremonies .
  Doug, you are empirically, and philosophically wrong, and your leftism will ever disallow you to see reality.  You shape your understanding of Truth to fit a vision of the world which you think SHOULD exist, not the one which does exist.  Your vision is exclusively based on the Hericlitan flux of a mongrel philosophy, which you have adopted through false premises, eclectic and imprecise methodology and time spent ‘in the trenches’ as you, yourself have termed your education experience. 
  This piece-meal philosophy which you believe in, is your mantra and your impediment.  Just as a dogmatic born-again Christian or an alcoholic fresh on the band wagon utilizes their emotional experience to shape their understanding of Truth, so does the leftist understand reality; based on feeling and hope, rather than on objectivity. 
  At your age, you might be able to fix ‘the scratch in your eye’ (as Ibsen termed the ailment which leads men to ignore reality) if you commit to objectivity. I’m certain that your life will improve for it.  Nobody can do it for you, but achieving a paradigm shift to true objective reality from a collectivist, subjectivist utopian philosophy is possible.  Good luck!

Funny what one learns with a few clicks. 1. The typical reactions of the educators - http://tfninsider.org/2014/06/11/review-of-new-book-teachers-versus-the-public/
2. A interesting item - “Fascinatingly, Americans in bad school districts unaware of their national ranking are particularly fond of public teacher unions. However, studies such as these, which illustrate the canyon between public and teachers, will help move the needle — already 59 percent of Americans say they have only a “little” or “some” trust in teachers.”
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2014/may/22/book-review-when-teachers-and-the-public-disagree/

3. Some more interesting titbits - http://educationnext.org/teachers-versus-public-book-review/

4. A quote - ““An eye-opening book about the current state of education reform. While teachers tend to support the status quo, the public—especially as it becomes more informed about school performance—is increasingly looking for major changes. And major changes are what our schools will need if they are to succeed at effectively educating our children for the modern world.”  http://www.brookings.edu/research/books/2014/teachers-versus-the-public

The key to reform, is to let the public know the true state of their schools. To which I agree, because the data streams of student outcomes and by extension, society is telling us that the status-quo of the educators should no longer stand.

Momnipotent, what exactly can be more REAL than PRODUCING RESULTS?

Tom and Malkin have actually taught children how to read. Children that have been attending our “excellent” schools for YEARS without learning how to read.
Tom is teaching a high school graduate to read and do basic math, and I think .. has voluntarily taught or is teaching elementary students that are in grade 3 or higher how to read how to read.

Malkin has been tutoring reading and writing and is freely distributing Stairway to Reading that a lot of people have used to successfuly teach their children how to read. Children that our wonderful schools and teachers failed to teach.

What’s real for you? Using big empty words?
You are using bombastic words but when it comes down to something essential to anybody’s functinoning in our society: reading nothing but excuses.

We care so much about poor children but we can’t possibly be expected to teach them, no sir. ..  not even how to read, let aside anything more, because .. after all.. they do come from a deprived background. We’ll just shower empty praise on them, keep them quiet and happy and give them an empty graduation piece of paper. Then they are no longer our problem.

Middle-class children do well. .. well, yeah, kind of, in a mediocre, struggling way, and only because their parents teach them at home or send them to Kumon or to private tutors. It’s not that they do well, it’s that they do not fail and that the lack of or very low standards make them look good by comparison.

We care so much about excellence .. but we can’t be expected to teach motivated students at the level they need ...that’s elitist ... after all everybody has to be equal, so let’s dumb them all down so that the general low achivement is not so glaring.

Momni,

“Get all this passion and expertise to the table and make a difference.”

That’s just what we are trying to do in our own way.

Dear Mr Europe

If you are going to talk about me you might want to get a few facts right. My wife own the school not me. 100% of the students are from China. They come here to finish high school to improve their chances to get into UT.

We do an outstanding job and place 100% of our students in UT or another fine university of THEIR choice. The secret formula is very small classes, 100% certified teachers long hours supervised homework handing in all technology at 10:30. All residential no home-stay.

I taught 40 years in public schools from K-University. I was a trustee an OSSTF official and a professor.

The Canadian system K-U is the world’s finest system in terms of RESULTS. I challenge anyone who doubts this to show a higher system of U/C grads.

Our criteria is for students from China.

They pass an English and math test at the grade 10 level and have an English language interview with the principal in person or on skipe.

Then they give us $26K per year tuition and $1300 per month room and board.

The parents we work with (from all over the globe) seem to think Peel’s two anglophone K-12 systems don’t do nearly enough to challenge its students. Methinks the education orthodoxy (the usual suspects) had better stop its navel lint cleaning and up local academic standards.Perhaps we could start by using a merit based system to hire frontline teachers. The hires shouldn’t be based on your schoolboard bloodlines or teacher union genetics as it now exists.

Americans, like everyone else only worse are loath to blame themselves. We have allowed too much poverty. I am too poor I am too absent from my children’s lives…...

The only difference between the low scoring Americans and say the high scoring Finns is the % of children in poverty.

Well said Madteacher, and on that note as I was reading the comments, a discussion on literacy was occurring on the local radio talk show. It was all about the cuts that have been up and down, and laterally across plus the lack of access to the reduced and water down literacy programs in both the K to 12 and for adults. How the cuts, reductions to the programs and the locked access doors have hurt the long term economy of Canada, but not the pocketbooks of the K to 12 crowd. The callers called in agreeing that the state of literacy is deplorable.

Tom writes - “Tell me again what a great job our schools are doing.  Especially the part about ‘equity’.”  So tell me Momnipotent, the great job our schools are doing. I would really like to know who are the parents with tenacity and courage. All the parents I know displaying the qualities have been silenced by the K to 12. Only the Anne Kidders’, head cheerleader for the K to 12 are permitted to speak. Momnipotent, you have no idea the tenacity and courage a parent needs to become an effective advocate for your child.  Tom’s young man, his mother is an typical example of what the K to 12 does in mowing down parents and their concerns.

About School Council as the “REAL” method to engage: The school council I was a member of was all about fundraising.  No problems were ever discussed for the principal shared most of Mr. Little’s views - there is nothing wrong with the school however we need more money.  Money solves everything. Wherever there is lack of money there is a problem, otherwise we have a perfect system. Whenever parents were trying to voice a concern they were reminded that a ” council is not a forum for complaints.”  School administrators fail to acknowledge problems. Most of us here are trying to figure out how to make things better because all the other places and methods failed.  I did try everything indeed and went through all the REAL pathways ...

Doug, you still have not answer Europe’s question. Please do, what is the criteria for students to be accepted in your private school. By the way Doug, thanks to the recently resigned chair of TDSB, quite the profit industry being generated for both public and private schools for international Chinese students. Doug, also omits his students are of the upper class of multi-millionaires.Lots to choose from in China, since 14 % of the population consists of multi-millionaires out of a population nearing 2 billion.

Mr. Doug, sorry, I though you had at least a percentage ownership in the school from the way you were describing your trips to China on behalf of the school.

To get the facts right, students from China could attend public Canadian high schools if they applied and paid tuition; TDSB high school tuition is 14,000 CAD.
So why are chinese students not choosing the excellent public schools at roughly half the price?

If you were to admit canadian students what would you base your admission decision upon?

Quite a bit of homework? That sounds good to me.

Supervision and continuous feedback? Excellent.

Testing for admission to grade 11? Very reasonable.
To teach effectively you need everybody in the same class to be ready for that grade’s level work.

Guarantees that if they do as instructed and put in the work required they get the knowledge they need? Superb.

So how on earth can you advocate for the public system the exact oppposite?
That is not to have tests or exams, not to have too much homework, having everybody pass from one grade to another regardless of whether or not they are ready for the next grade?

Edubeat

The easiest thing in the world to do is to make the system either easier or harder. The difficulty comes in to make it the appropriate level of difficulty.

Those peole are used to heavily streamed systems that leave most kids behind. Those are stupid systems. They are welcome to go back to gheir more challenging systems that fail most kids. Lovely.

Those systems are not superior to the Canadian system as PISA shows.

Momnipotent,

I commented on your plea for more parents to become proactive on the previous blog posting.  You are incorrect in thinking that school trustees and/or superintendents have any power in making changes that are actually beneficial for the students.  They represent the establishment and do not have a mandate for meaningful change.

As Nancy has pointed out here and in other places, being an effective advocate requires tremendous strength, will and courage.  Many parents simply do not have the time nor the confidence to go up against school principals or the establishment to fight for their child.  When I tried to find out why my kid wasn’t learning her times tables in Gr.4, I was told the basics were woven into the curriculum…by trustees,
principals and teachers.  Well that’s nice.  In the meantime, her confidence had spiralled down, she started lying and also hating school.  Not a great scenario for a child who previously loved school.  If we hadn’t gotten involved to correct this situation, getting her enrolled in Kumon and working with her Gr.5 teacher the following year, we’d have a very different child to be dealing with if we’d have believed what we were told over and over again by the establishment. 

Your judgment call against parents and grandparents is astounding.  It is NOT our job to tell teachers and educators how to teach our children, that is why we fund our school system with our tax dollars.  However, an increasingly growing number of us have no choice BUT to get involved, based on the current system we are left to deal with.  So instead of shifting the blame on to us, I would suggest looking at supporting other parents out there who are starting local grassroot organizations asking for some meaningful change in the system.  Tom’s comment regarding schools resonates with me as well.  We really don’t have much to be proud about lately.

Even last year I would have partaken in this passionate conversation.

Now,I know it`s all for not.
You could call Kathleen Wynne,she`ll throw a few marbles around her mouth,talk about Mike Harris and say all the stuff Doug Little does.

Without federal involvement and pressure,we won`t get any change.

The U.S. has grants for change and a rallying cry,the U.K.has the Ministry of Ed. insisting on explicit systematic phonics to alleviate their incessant public school failures,mounting annually.

Without pressure from somewhere and much much more open humiliation,the insane will continue to run the asylum.

My favorite posting is madteacher and Tom`s Brech!
They don`t even look for solutions!They can show a 50% passcard in grade 3 and do it annually.Zero consequences.

Not even a slap on the wrist!

In my own work,I`ve been begging for a third party study from a University.
Naturally,I found one in the U.S.
That says it all.

I am a paid employee of my wife’s school.

The students write a basic English test and math test I said. It is the basis of acceptance. Also an English interview with the principal.

This is a second language but not ESL school.

Nancy,

A year at VIP probably costs $40K depending on whether they need or want our absolute guarantee of UT.

We have many checks and balances in the system for non-educators to intervene in the system.

We elect MPPs which means that non-educators must favour the views of oh say Kathleen Wynne over Tim Hudak.

We have school board elections. I assume most non-educators involve themselves so the general direction of boards should be what they want.

We have parent councils at local schools We have many associations for different kinds of students.

Could it be…. is it possible… that the general direction of the school system is pretty close to what people actually want?

Just sayin’

We don’t ave much to be proud of? We are the best in the world.

Evana has an excellent point - ” Whenever parents were trying to voice a concern they were reminded that a ” council is not a forum for complaints.”  School administrators fail to acknowledge problems. Most of us here are trying to figure out how to make things better because all the other places and methods failed.  I did try everything indeed and went through all the REAL pathways ...”

Certainly true and based on fact. Below is an interesting paper and a big one consisting of over 200 pages. The title - Principals and the Strategies Used in Interacting with School Councils
Richard S. Ritter
Ontario Institute for Studies in Education
http://www.hpedsb.on.ca/ec/services/its/documents/StrategiesUsedwithSchoolCouncilsOISEUofTRRitter.pdf

No date but I believe it was published in 2012 or 2013. In it one will learn what the educrats at OISE and other teacher faculties think of school councils. No need to have parents being involved in governance. Is there any wonder why the school councils are turned into formal places of fundraising?  ” For the first time in
Ontario‘s history, parents had legally binding access to their children‘s schools. The councils were the government‘s method of making the school directly accountable to the parents and other members of the community.”

The way parents are treated especially when their kids chooses to draw a picture showing their daddy with a gun, the parent gets arrested but parents have legal access to their children’s school??  Not at all a welcoming place for parents, as one will find out when reading. “While generally in education we speak of parents as partners, tell parents in our school newsletters that we have an open door policy, and talk about parents as their children‘s
first teachers, we unconsciously send other strong messages to parents. With our signs, our displays, our activities and our labeling of space, we position parents in marginalized ways in our school buildings. At best we extend them the privileges of guests and at worst we treat them as unwelcome or bothersome interlopers.”

On page 32 - It gets really interesting - “If they feel it necessary, principals find the skills needed to curb parental voice. As ―gatekeepers‖, principals become filters of information and knowledge for councils.”

There is also new information revealed, that should put the educators and principals in the uncomfortable position of defending the status-quo of the K to 12 where parents of all shapes and sizes as unwelcome guests.

JUST ANOTHER TRAP TO KEEP PARENTS DISPOSSESSED

“The school and the home need not be in conflict so long as the former controlled the latter, not the other way around.” — (Parents and Schools, the 150 year struggle for control in American education, p83, William Cutler, 2000)

1   I’ve experienced 50 years of the 150 years Cutler writes about. From research as well, I’ve come to see how the relentless and ruthless exclusion and attack on parents has come about, and why.  Why?  Blatant self interest — secure government jobs/careers, power, opportunity to promote utopian (elitist) experiments to change society and human nature, etc., etc.  As long as parents produce the precious natural raw resource — children — they are still accorded some space, but mostly symbolic. 

2   Parents are kept in YO-YO mode — always hopeful that the next break-through will open the floodgates to relieve pent-up-demand and frustrations.  The Moore legal case with a satisfactory resolution after 15 years of litigation raised hopes for greater responsiveness from an arrogant and sluggish system — little uptake so far.

3   This latest book — Teachers versus the Public: What Americans Think about Schools and How to Fix Them — seems like just another cruel teaser to keep parents hopeful but distanced.  Though I haven’t read the book (ordered) I’ve read some of the free pages and reviews. I haven’t seen any promising strategies yet for parents or public to gain that elusive accountability they seek from a public service.

4   The book talks about some “iron triangle” which holds the system together. The iron triangle is some subset of producers and regulators, combining in various ways, to maintain control at the public’s expense. This combine survives “by means of closed doors, secret meetings, quiet negotiations . . . “ But, “when the public becomes better informed, fresh air [oxygen] corrodes the iron triangle . . . it begins to rust and disintegrate.”  Nice image, but I don’t buy it.  Society for Quality Education has been providing the “oxygen” for over a decade, but this new book has it right: The public is “too episodic and scattered to have an impact” — thus business as usual — monopoly, take it or leave it — few do.

5   The book portrays the teacher unions as a big obstacle that thwarts “reform”.  The cover shows a horde of (mainly) red-shirted protesters in Wisconsin when Governor, Scott Walker got tough.  We had two BCTF officials (Pres, VP) attending.  But if this is the case (remember, I haven’t read the whole book) this is so WRONG.  The educrats, the BLOB (Bloated Learning Organized Bureaucracy) actually LOVE using teacher unions as the scapegoat — someone to blame for all their own inertia, deviousness, exploitation — glibly using this weasel phrase: “Our hands are tied.”

6   Let’s also lump the publisher of this book (Brookings Inst.) into the BLOB category.  So many think tanks and foundations and education pundits purport to be for “real reform” but just skirt the issues while providing for books and reports to be published and a fabulous come-on to induce massive research funds to “improve education!” Many of these “researchers” would be out jobs if education were truly responsive and satisfactory to the client and taxpayer base.

7   It’s the parents (guardians, grandparents) whose biological roles have been usurped by an ever-expanding producer multitude that feeds off this system.  This BLOB has learned the sweet-talking methods of keeping the raw materials coming.  It has designed codes of conduct forms that parents sign that give wide license for experimentation without psychological protocols. 

8 I close this lecture with a quote received today on these pages from Frank Gue, which nicely says it all:

“Years ago an acquaintance who is a principal in the Ontario system, and who lectures teachers in summer school at an Ontario university, explained the “Constructivist” (“Learning by discovery”) model to me.
I became more and more worried.  Finally I asked, “But surely, at the end of the day, you want to graduate a numerate, literate student?”  The reply, delivered in a distinctly unfriendly tone, was, “Why?”
This one word, “Why?”, says it all, doesn’t it?  There is an element of the Education Establishment that is actively uninterested in educating children!”  [I hope you don’t mind, Frank, for adding this. I was so touched.  See comments in “The plot thickens”]

Dear Doretta, (07/28)

I know what you are trying to do in your own way - just trying to nudge you along to smart real change in real time. 

You continue to have difficulty with my name.  Intriguing as this is the group advocating efficacy in literacy.  So as you can see, just for you,  I have simplified things.
all the best,

Potent.

( please use your best self-control not to turn that into ‘potie’
-grin)

Dear Europe (07/28)

I acknowledge that Tom and Malkin have taught children to read.  What I dismiss is that teaching children to read is a remarkable accomplishment.

I expect that about 6 billion of the 7 billion on this earth can read.

What Tom and Malkin have done which is remarkable is to help the outliers who are struggling move along on the continuum.

Europe, I have my own children who can read and write at a level that has been recognized as remarkable.

I teach children in a secondary school in a large community in the 905 - Ontario reference.  I have never, never, never, in my almost thirty years encountered a child who could not read or write.

I have encountered other deficits in their cognitive tool kit - which we work to eliminate.  We, the academic teachers, who work as a team.  We do this regardless of the silly principal or the coaches masquerading as teachers.  And for the most part we get it done - without resources,  poor textbooks, and pressure to limit the number of photocopies of material we distribute to students.

Happily my own children are master communicators (reading and writing at a high level) and the students that I work with are proficient.  In thirty years in secondary school the students that I have worked with .......160 students per year….. my reality supports what PISA reports. 

Tom and Malkin’s tutoring of the lowest 5% is laudable but statistically not representational of the entire pie.

Evana,

What you are describing is the same two step tango that weak principals have perpetrated on parents since Mike Harris put in regulation 612 and regulation 613 into the education act.

I and many other amazing women fought this fight.  My team had many winning season.  I would be happy to share how to get some of this done.

Malkin has my permission to disclose my email to you that we can start a conversation on how you and your mom friends may be more effective.

Please Malkin - if Evana wants to pursue this- share my email.

By the comments on this posting—Malkin’s point has been clearly made.

To counter Potent and her watered down account of the literacy levels in Canada. Potent speaks the truth there is only 774 million adults across the globe that cannot read. However, what she omits is the fact that anywhere between 40 to 60 percent in developed countries have only basic to below basic literacy skills. Nor does PISA support Potent’s assertions either, and neither the OECD latest report for adult literacy and numeracy skills. For Canada, 49 percent are below or at basic literacy skills at level 1 and 2, and the OECD is urging the K to 12 education systems to improve reading levels of students to level 3.

Potent, boasts about her own children’s reading levels and as well as her students she taught, leaving the impression to readers there is no literacy problems. Then, she goes on to dismiss Tom’s work, his observations and his expertise as not being relevant to the bigger picture. On the contrary Tom’s work reflects what the K to 12 education establishment will not do, and that is to ensure all students graduating are equipped with average to above levels in literacy and numeracy. Basic literacy and numeracy no longer cuts it in the 21st century, but try telling that one to the K to 12 establishment, and one is confronted with the brick wall of a K to 12 built and design to ensure low literacy and numeracy rates.

As for the 5 % number that Potent arrived at, government stats from federal to provincial to municipality are at numbers 30 percent and higher, trying to provide programs and funding to remediate and upgrade the literacy skills of their citizens. Potent ought to be looking at the billion of dollars being spent by governments to deal with the fallout on low literacy skills., training programs and the price being paid in Canada’s economy. However, the K to 12 establishment and their pocketbooks are making steady profits at the expense of the public and government coffers.

Note: Tom’s young man would not qualify in any of the government programs on the go. Tom is doing yeoman’s service to bring the young man up to a level that he would meet the criteria to enter the government programs. This is due to all the cuts in funding that has taken place in literacy remediation and upgrading programs. That is another story for another day, on how the K to 12 profit by ensuring there is a steady supply of graduates leaving the K to 12 in great need of remediation and upgrading in literacy and numeracy skills.

Thanks, Nancy. 

There are different numbers floating around for literacy.  Middle class kids tend to do fine, especially when their mom is a teacher. 

But some communities have drop-out rates of 75% - and those mostly-illiterate kids don’t even get counted by the EQAO.  This is worse than disgraceful.

Momnipotent,

Evana’s post is reflective of what is happening across Canada.  Having your input here on your success against a previous Ontario politician will do little to address these same issues which are still prevalent clear across this country.

School boards and the like represent the status quo; that is their purpose.  Real change needs to come from the grassroots level, as the voice of taxpayers is much louder than that of any school administrator or bureaucrat.  Furthermore, these school leaders are not hired to challenge the educrats or policy makers.  They are mandated to ensure as many kids graduate as possible, even if many aren’t capable of reading a book properly or perform an Algebra equation. Teachers are then left to try and deal with the fallout of poor curricula and weak policies that are currently in place.  They are doing the best that they can.

Which is why individuals such as Tom, Doretta and Malkin are incredibly important to try and make a difference in these kids’ lives.  It’s disappointing that you cannot recognize that.

[Still talking about this book — Teachers versus the Public — and still wondering if it will make one IOTA of difference ???  Below is what I just commented on the post “It’s Important”, July 26]

ANOTHER REASON TEACHERS DON’T SEE THE SAME UNRESPONSIVENESS . . .

“The authors reveal that it is teachers themselves —not just their union representatives —who stand opposed to school reforms a majority of the public favors. In many ways this points to a much larger problem with improving our schools.” —Eric A. Hanushek

We’re talking about the book — Teachers versus the Public: What Americans Think about Schools and How to Fix Them.

The book shows a strong divide between how the public & parents perceive public education and how teachers do.  Teachers find fewer faults with the schools than the public does.  One review already pointedly concludes:  Why should the teachers find fault? Their good pay, benefits, pensions and job security says they are in a good spot.  Why should they care if the public is not satisfied?

Well, here is another reason teachers like the public school system.  They, unlike other parents, do not suffer the obstacles ordinary parents do when trying to obtain services and responsiveness.  As insiders, they know all their rights (which BTW most parents don’t) and they know how to wangle all they need on behalf of their own children.

Please see the 15 advantages Teacher-Parents enjoy that Ordinary Parents do not in our public schools (BTW, there’s more than 15, but that’s all I codified so far):

Teachers as Parents are Hugely Advantaged – Unfair
http://www.parentsteachingparents.net/?s=snarky

Tom how are they not caught by EQAO? They drop out before grade 3? Please deal with the facts.

Tom writes - “But some communities have drop-out rates of 75% - and those mostly-illiterate kids don’t even get counted by the EQAO.  This is worse than disgraceful.”

I have been exploring the academic papers on a relatively new topic being researched on how governments creates barriers, locked access doors and natural pathways to prevent and block people from accessing knowledge. The K to 12 plays a major role in creating natural pathways that leads people to voluntarily avoid the various doors to knowledge. Having low literacy creates a natural barrier for people navigating the knowledge networks in the 21st century. It is sufficient to state, that the K to 12 along with the governance and operations of government have the greatest advantages by ensuring at least 50 % of the population have low literacy rates.

It is interesting to note, it is not a political left or right spectrum but rather a deep examination on the operations of governments and its agencies and how the various parts of government colludes to prevent people from bettering themselves and progressing to a higher social-income level. It is very complex, but the premise is simple. Prevent people to obtain average to above proficiency in the 3 Rs. The other task, is to prevent the damning data outcomes from reaching the public ears who do have proficient levels of the 3 Rs. Most of the K to 12 crowd would dismiss Tom’s statement as high rhetoric, but no it represents the realities in our low-income schools and some lower middle-class schools to the rural schools.

One is missing Tunya. The social capital of the educators outside of the walls of a school being used to gain advantages for their children by having the rules, regulations of the physical activity to the art activity to even story-time at the library change to gain unfair advantage over other children whose parents are not teachers.

There are some harrowing tales by parents on the antics of teacher-parents. I even have my own where I traded barbs with teachers who thought my children should downplay their skills that would handicap them for placing in the medals. It all started in the summer of 1979. My oldest child, then 5 years old had the skills of being able to catch and throw the ball in ringette. She earned the right to become the back-catcher. Well the teacher-parent who was the head leader was having none of it. The teacher-parent rounded up a posse of other parents to removed my child as the back-catcher, even though she was the only one that could catch and throw the ball to the pitcher or anyone in the in-field. The teacher’s kid was the replacement by default because I withdrew my child.

There is nothing worse than having teacher-parents bringing their pedagogy to the sport fields and recital halls that lie outside of the walls of schools. Teacher-parents are threatened by the competition and skills sets of other children. They use their social capital to gain unfair advantage for their children. PS - The ringette team did not win another game that season. The last game won was the first game of the season, and was the only time that my child played.

The World Literacy Foundation - The kind of foundation that Tom should contact if he is looking for some support and funding. Tom’s initiative is just the type that fits in nicely with the goals of the global foundation and for the concerns in low literacy of developed countries such as Canada.

The economic costs to Canada - $27.78 billion dollars is what is costing Canada in functional illiteracy or low literacy. http://www.worldliteracyfoundation.org/The_Economic_&_Social_Cost_of_Illiteracy.pdf

The website - http://www.worldliteracyfoundation.org/our-leadership/

“In developed countries, it’s the story of a person who cannot function in a highly technological society where living and working day to day requires being able to read and sum.” 

Meanwhile, a link from an educator’s blog that would put Doug’s little barb in its place. It does not help to advance the discussion. ” The data will be largely unused to increase the quality of education, but politicians and real estate agents will find the information indispensable.  All of this will cost the taxpayer, according to some sources, the low figure of $33 million a year.  Money well spent?  Hardly.”

The data largely goes unused in the K to 12 schools, resulting in few if any effective programs and innovation by school staff to improve overall literacy and numeracy levels of students. Or just ask any parent if the classroom educator used the EQAO results of their child for individual learning plans. Or as Tom has stated in another post, the bigger problem is systemic in nature and the unwillingness of the K to 12 establishment.

At another level are the education theorists and where some have given voice on the literacy issues. Below is one that talks the talk but does very little in removing the barriers that prevents full literacy in Canada. “In my early years as a teacher, I also recognized that literacy is the master key to future life chances. It is a foundation for learning and a primary means of social and economic empowerment. Statistics Canada, for example, tells us that a mere one per cent gain in average literacy and numeracy skill levels in Canada would add a permanent increase of $18.4 billion per year to the country’s GDP. We do know that investment in human capital leads to economic growth. And we also know that low levels of literacy skills contribute to unemployment.
I encourage you as graduates to become the generation of teachers who will stamp out illiteracy and ensure that Canada continues to be one of the best places in the world in which to live.”
http://leadersandlegacies.com/2014/06/02/literacy-is-the-master-key-to-future-life-chances-dr-avis-glaze/

And her website - http://www.avisglaze.ca/about/

I leave it to readers to determine the percentage of K to 12 ideologies and dogma that Avis Glaze has, but she sure does the talk on literacy, but there is no action that goes beyond the talk.

In my post, concerning Doug’s little barb I forgot to include the link - http://andrewscampbell.com/2013/03/26/opting-out-of-eqao-one-parents-story/

Very funny Doug.  Grade-3.  You are killing me.

More seriously, the EQAO reports an 82% pass rate on the OSSLT (and you must pass to get your diploma).  That doesn’t sound particularly awful, but it only counts kids who are STILL IN SCHOOL.  For some communities that becomes a very small number.

Nancy, your research sometimes astonishes me!  Kudos.

Momnipotent, potent,  Mirka (?)—whoever you are—you imply that in a single semester that children in your class have proficient writing skills?  Grammar isn’t a one-shot deal.  Math, languages, music and writing skills take years of practise. 

I can only conclude that you have low standards, and if you’re aka, Mirka, you may be excellent in your field, but from some of your previous blogs, I could see that you need to crack open a few grammars for your own benefit. ..

I’ve seen many university grades struggle with grammar,  basic arithmetic, and they can’t hold a pen properly while writing in a childish script.  In other words, they’re lacking any refinement because basics such as the above were not taught to them in school.

Momnipotent thank you for giving me more details.

* Would you care to share what subjects have you been teaching in high school?

* Did your children become very good readers and writers only with what they learned in school or did you have to help them at home .. to what degree .. how many hours/week how many times .. did they get outside tutoring?

In the spirit of this post I’d like to clarify where I’m coming from.
I expect my son, being as inteligent or perhaps a bit more inteligent than I was as a kid and living in a very rich country to have at least the same competencies and skills I had at the same ages.

Even though my son is considered a very good student - top 300 in Canada in math competitions, level 4 in the compulsory math and english tests in high school - and has good grades in a specialized program - low 90s he knows less than I did at his age and studies less than I did on a weekly average basis.
He took math, science, english, french at an enriched level.
What they learned in grade 10 math is about 1.5 years behind what I did at his age and without mathematical proofs, science the teachers were good but the curriculum is watered down and very jumbled together, French is decent but I find is hit and miss to extremes depending on the teacher, English is good but I find is hit and miss depending on the teacher.
The few high school courses he took at academic level he learned very little because in his words .. it’s not clear what I’m expected to do, I have to work in a group with kids that don’t care and do shitty work and I get graded on the group mark, some of them can’t even write an intelligible sentence. The teacher taught only about half of the material he needed to teach us and he grades inconsistently. So my son basically did ok work and sat quietly making fun of the mayhem.

Really, at least in terms of math and science a student considered very good - just like he is considered here - in India or China is probably a good 1-2 year ahead of him in terms of knowlege and ability to stick to task.

I went to a public school in a big city in Eastern Europe some 35 years ago. My parents certainly had high expectations for me since I was not hungry the way they were as kids during the war and since I had my own room and therefore peace and quiet to be able to learn. My parents did check my homework when I was in the early grades but they did not do homework with me and I had zero outside tutoring. We had books at home - cheap, popular editions of the classics - I was read to as a toddler but my parents not teach me how to read so that I would not get bored and cause trouble in grade 1.

Dear Bev,  or Amanda? 

I love that you decry in the midst of the information revolution that students today , ”  can’t hold a pen properly while writing in a childish script.  In other words, they’re lacking any refinement because basics such as the above were not taught to them in school.”

Beautiful, distilled to its essential argument, in the midst of the third revolution in the information economy you are arguing that they could not be scribes in ancient Rome!

And just for grins, when I was taught cursives in Europe - the real learning happened at home with three hours of practice each and every night.  How I held my pen and what I did with in was left to my parents because even 45 years ago the world was sufficiently complicated that the schools had to spend the bulk of their time on other skills like basic algebra and chemistry - yup in elementary school.  The practice of hard skills happened at home - it was called homework.

Tara,

I hear you, and I get it.  My own advocacy for my kids in elementary school was the hardest thing.  The most entrenched silly happens in elementary schools.  Just the nature of the beast.

That is when in my little village a mom-revolution shook the status quo.  Began with me calling all my children’s friends parents and getting them to parent council meetings.  I was shameless - we had debrief dinners,  email list to share resources , took control of the school council agenda and the principal was consulted as a courtesy per regulation 612 and 613.  70% of the parents who showed up at the school council meetings were setting the agenda, and more critically communicating before and AFTER each meeting.  With those odds it is not that difficult to carry the table.

All of it got easier in high school for us. 

I recognize what Tom and Malkin do - I am simply challenging them to do more in real time .  I get really irritated with the doomsday american posts that only serve to dis empower parents.

THIS is Canada.  There is much that can be done to improve academic realities this year——and next year———and the next 30 years while the conversation for school choice continues.

Honestly Tara, with no malice,  please explain to me how parents who are not able or willing to go to a school council meeting - and then get their ducks in order and go back— and then go back again—- wait then at least 10 more times—- how are these parents going to be architects of schools…......

Europe,

I am surmising that your son is a junior in high school (question).

I think-know that literacy is harder for boys.  My own children are girls so literacy in my experience is a bit more approachable in this society.  But dear heart, we are paying the piper on other fronts.  Girls in this society need some leverage - see the CBC documentary on the F-word (feminism) .

BOYs absolutely need some help that is different.  The key thing you can do is to be active in selecting teachers that are effective with boys.  Hope that does not sound silly.  At my school there are teachers including myself that provide a boy friendly environment.  The best use of your time and resources is to CONNECT with other parents and find who those teachers are.  Then you see your student resource teacher and get the timetable changed to fit the needs of your child.  They always start with no - treat is as the beginning of negotiation…. HELL you are Eastern European you must know that the first three noès are just posturing. 

The key is is to avoid the prissy patties that penalize boys just for being boys.

As for your son—what he is learning as opposed to you learned at his age.  *We* come from a system that streamed early .  In my country by grade 5 we eliminated the sales clerks and the construction workers from the chemists and the philosophers.  In Canada we do not do this sort of ruthless hunger games scenario.  Everyone gets a crack at the big dream.  Happily , it does all even out and Canada ends up outperforming all the Eastern European countries in international assessment.

BUT you just want to help your brilliant right brain boy.

Good news, as you know, he will do just fine given what you self-reported.  If you want to bolster the left brain for your baby there are many ways to go.  The simplest is to take him to interesting movies-documentaries,  turn on the CBC, especially their IDEAS and QUIRKS and QUARKs broadcasts.  The ROM is something our family loves as a great outing.

I am humbly arguing that the best thing you can to is not worry about what is missing in his schooling and provide enriching opportunities within your family life. 

The schooling stuff will all sort out - on the timeline very different from your European experience .  Both my parents taught in Eastern Europe and then taught here in Canada.  They were the first to introduce to the idea to me that the continuum here and in Europe progresses at different paces.  But the final outcome serves our Canadian students very well.

The key , in my thirty years in the classroom dealing with boys,

* needs a crew to be part of a friend group which leads to—-

*needs to be part of a parent group (challenge for immigrants - at home you had an expansive family - now you need a surrogate group that will function in the same manner to support the children.

* needs traditions, family meals, outings, etc to connect to

Europe,  I too am an immigrant finding my way parenting and watch my children in the system and do my best to mitigate the silly.  In high school you have flexibility to manage who teaches them.  You have incredible pull if you are a member of a school council.  If you are a school council chair which is remarkably simple to do—your kids can avoid any of the coaches pretending to be teachers that would sideline their learning.

Bev,

Thank you for the feedback on my grammar.  I am   much better in my mother tongue.  English is my second language.

How many languages are you proficient in?

I shall bring some good news this morning, to the dismay of Potent, (AKA Mirka) - The topic of education has finally broke into the consciousness of Canadians on social media circles. Namely, Canada’s decline in education crossing the span. Mirka should be on the political pages sending her condescending barbs and parenting tips to Canadians who are paying the price in real dollars to obtained a decent education for their children. I put in my own two cents this morning, and the educators responding in kind agreeing with me. At least they claimed to be educators who have seen the same outcomes in their classrooms.

Mirka, is part of the crowd at the K to 12 who think of the public as being broken and in need of being directed and if need be, shoved to follow the experts in education. This set of experts uses mockery to avoid any discussions about the education outcomes that for the most part the public expresses dismay over the student outcomes.

Mirka, like others of her kind do not support their contentions with the evidence. We will never know until she reveals the name, rank and serial numbers of the school she is teaching in, the city and no doubt the upscaled neighbourhood she is living in. It would make for an interesting study if what Mirka has claimed and asserted is really happening in real time. It could be a template. Perhaps Mirka should contact P4E Anne Kidder to fund it. I am sure she would be interested if it was that simple as Mirka has outlined. However, I have a feeling that Kidder would dismiss Mirka because Kidder knows it is not that simple since there is major problems in areas of education that has contributed to the education decline in Canada at the expense of Canadian students’ education.

Where is the good news Nancy,I`m interested:)

Nancy,about Avis Glaze.

She was the head of the Literacy Secretariat before McGuinty..can`t remember this am who was in charge then.
I presented my program to her and her team,I always present based on the empirical research of the NICHD 35 year longitudinal study and National Reading Panel findings,2001.

They sat there and I assure you were not welcoming.
They had their own “ideas” on teaching literacy which they conquered their Ontario in.
She won all kinds of community prizes.

We have to get everyone to stop teaching kids to read based on their opinion.That`s the mission.Then,we`d do a lot better.

With Math,we will soon in the next 18 months anyway,have a very large study on Jump Math.
If the results are very positive,will they buy in,my research so far says they could care less what works or doesn`t work.A different force is at play.

Just like you, Mirka, I’m only proficient in one.
Amanda

Yes Joanne, that is why I left it up to the readers. Avis gives good talks on literacy but no further action besides talking.

Here is one - a letter to the editor - http://www.pinchercreekecho.com/2014/07/30/harpers-road-to-decline

As I stated, it is across the social media. This morning I was ever surprised to see the education topic in my own social media circles that are political in nature and in some cases social. But what is exciting, ordinary people making the connections to the lives of their children to the education being received. People are really worried about their children’s future considering the realities on the ground. High unemployment levels for the   youth to parents paying big dollars in tutors and everything in between concerning government policies and their outcomes.

It has been building up for quite some time. Canadians are not happy campers no matter where they stand on the political line. The key difference now, is that ordinary Canadians are talking about in their social media circles, and education is the topic. Two years ago, the number one agenda of the K to 12 education ministries was the worrisome trend of losing the public’s confidence. One year ago, the decline in the numbers of Canadians who lost confidence in the K to 12 education system was evident. Yesterday, in my corner of the world - instead of bringing the Susan Barton reading program into the schools, the tutoring program is now offered at a private college. I am sure the K to 12 is now directing parents to pay the going rate because the school will not provide. However, at least the positive silver lining is that there is another option for parents whom have children struggling in reading and for the adults. Suffice to say, it does not bode well for the K to 12. They are well on its way to lose the public’s confidence altogether based on their actions and all talk.

Canada has the world’s best education system K-U without doubt based on RESULTS. Nobody else is even close.

Results for who Doug?  The foreign students who are welcome with open arms as long as they have the dollars to pay for it? You ought to check what the ordinary working Canadians and students are thinking and saying about all the foreign students taking up seats in programs like the trades, while putting Canadian students on a 5 year waiting list. Or the Canadian youth who can’t find a summer job because the cheaper foreign worker has taken over. Made worse by the declarations of the employers that the foreign workers have the skills including how to add and subtract compared to the Canadians.

Not a peep from the K to 12 gang. No one from that crowd has used their political capital to defend or not to defend. I can only conclude the K to 12 is neutral to served their own best interests. Sure Canada has the world’s best education system because it only serves the Canadians who work in the K to 12. You really ought to read what the commoners are thinking, Doug. It would be a lesson in humility and eating crow.

Foreign students ate a small % of the total.

Canadians ( not foreigners) have more degrees and diplomas per capita than any other nation by far. Russia and Israel #2 &3 not even close.

The problem for post secondary in Canada is sky high tuition.

I advocate totally free post secondary as far as tuition is concerned and generous grants and loans for living expenses.

With that policy we would run away on the world. Free ECE down to age 2 and we would be so far ahead nobody would ever catch up.

Expensive? Education is always expensive. Ignorance is far more expensive.

Oh by the way Nancy I believe the TFW program should be totally abolished.

It will kill the Conservatives in the next election. Ask Malkin what she thinks of TFW program.

Doug, stop downplaying the facts. It is a multi-billion dollar industry across the globe where the K to 12 to the post-secondary institutes are profiting hugely in places like Canada. It all has to do with the deregulation of foreign student and worker visas. It is why your little private school for rich Chinese students is so successful. Gosh, even the wealthier Americans who send their children to the posh private schools are complaining. You ought to read the European pages and from time to time the American pages.

There is also colourful graphs showing as foreign students increase their share of seats, the tuition rates for the domestic students increase accordingly as the student grants and scholarships decrease for the domestic students. Thus putting North American students having some of the highest student debts in the world. Over in Europe, instead of student debt the domestic students do not meet the criteria in grades to entered the free university and other post-secondary programs.

For every action, there is a reaction. The foreign student visas programs are slowly killing the education quality being received in places like Canada. In the same the foreign worker program are killing jobs for Canadians. At the graduate programs in university, only 25 % of the students are Canadians and the rest are foreign students.

And yet Doug, parents in Canada are paying out of their own pocketbook to send their children to tutors for the 3 Rs. The same 3 Rs that are not being taught very well in the K to 12. The decline in education is costing the Canadian economy $27.78 billion dollars. I am sure it is made up on the other side, by charging big dollars to one and all to access the gates of education. If not, the Canadians can remain unemployed while watching the foreign workers take over their jobs, and await for an opening on a course that has a 5 year waiting list.

Nancy I oppose the TFW program totally. The point of the program is to drive down Canadian wages. This is Tory doing and they will pay for it.

TFWorkers are not here due to math skills please. They are here because they are cheap labour.

To clarify some of the points I was making earlier

*1)  The students who we think are doing well or very well are less competent compared to equivalent students from other countries.
The system is cheating them as well because for better or for worse our kids will compete for the same jobs, for the same places in good university programs.

*2)  Good and very good students that the education establishment highlights as being students for whom the system works are NOT a product of the system. They are the result of the parent’s hard work, resources and the extra time these students have spent practicing.

The reason is simple: elementary public schools don’t teach well enough for a student to be able to understand the subjects without outside help. Moreover practice is shunned and homework - both the type of homework and the amount of homework is utterly inadequate.

*3)  Is it fair that a parent has to spend oodles of time to work the system in order to get decent teachers for their kid?

Who are the parents who can do that if they have a full-time job where they cannot necessarily punch the clock and leave at four and on top of that their commute is the average GTA commute of about 60 min each way?

Let me tell you who: parents who have jobs where their can leave work before 4 pm or the parents who have flexibility in their work or the parents that are well off enough for the mother to work part time or to have nannies. 
Does that sound like the majority of the people?

And again .. how about the other kids?

Doug, it is happening across the Western democracies regardless of political stripe. Even in places like Finland,  trying to attract international students while opening up the domestic labour markets to foreign workers. One of the results of globalizing labour market, is the reduction of wages in the domestic labour markets of Western countries. The employers who used foreign labour, the foreign workers have better skills than the domestic workers is one of their main points and they back it up with dismal data streams in literacy and numeracy.

So it is not a political right or left thing but rather one of the nastier negative outcomes under globalization. It then becomes under the political sphere in the domestic countries to sort out the downfall. Either way, left or right, the politicians have no intentions of solving it, but only managed the fallout in their respective countries. In the same way, the K to 12 only manages the fallout in student achievement rather than fixing it for good by ensuring 95 % or more students have average to above average skills in the 3 Rs. Of course the current crop in the K to 12, stated over and over again it is an impossible task. The K to 12 crowd even stated that in the Moore case at the Supreme Court of Canada. Good thing the nine Supreme Court justices disagreed…....

I’ve been reading the discussions here for a very long time and felt it was time to challenge Potent (Mirka’s) suggestion that school councils in Ontario are working even marginally so as conduits to either the greater community or in promoting a partnership between educators and parents. In short, they do nothing of the sort.

I would also caution folks here not to be fooled by lines like “I and many other amazing women fought this fight. My team had many winning seasons.”  Why?  Simply because those “women” who truly DO fight for parents and their rights/roles in the system also include all those here like Malkin, Joanne, Doretta, who have won successes of their own and from the grassroots, NOT because they tied themselves to the apron strings of Annie Kidder and People for Education.

It’s also very easy as a teacher herself to see her “team” as having “many winning seasons” when you’re head cheerleader for the system that continues to see way too many kids fall through the cracks. What better instrument of support for all things the public system has to offer than a teacher/parent/teacher/parent. It’s a perfect vortex of a web for unsuspecting parents isn’t it?

Let’s also not fail to mention that very good and dedicated men make up the ranks of advocates in this province who do their own great work to promote parent advocacy.

I would have to agree with Doretta’s post @ 7:11am that holds posts particular ones like PotentMirka’s up as making Malkin’s case very well.

Thanks to the wonders of new technologies it’s easy to find that Potent teaches science at a Hamilton Catholic Secondary School.  When the public system bestows awards on parents/teachers it seals some insurance that folks like Potent will go the extra mile to jam it down the throats of everyone and anyone who will give them an audience.

Good thing with this forum is that it’s refreshing and quite telling that no one’s buying it.

Nancy, re student visa programs.

Yes, Ontario has quite a lot of foreign students studying in university and colleges in a variety of programs.

* A lot of these programs will likely not be sustainable without the foreign students since there is less and less public funding for colleges and university.
The foreign student’s tuition is much higher - around twice as high, I think -  than what our kids pay.

* In addition - thanks to our wonderful education system - a lot of the foreign students are better qualified than Ontario students for programs that require a hard skills to a large degree such as engineering, accounting, math, applied science, business - finance, testing and quality assurance.

Good for them! They had the teachers, the curriculum, the competition, they put in years of hard work .. the result is that these foreign students are competent.

You can’t have something for nothing.

Heck, over 50% of the our students have already decided by grade 10 that they have to do something that does not involve math or science because they hate it or they are not good at it .... I wonder why?
This is one of the drivers for the vast number of kids competing to become lawyers, physicians, elementary teachers, marketing or human resource professionals. These are all well paying professions where you can avoid math and physics.

That is a scary outing of someone’s personal info.

I am an open book but not everybody wants to be.

Doug, your little missive is a tiresome one dating back to the 1980s. ““If we regard international education as a Canadian “export” – in the sense that Canadians are working to produce services offered to and paid by residents of other countries – international education services can be considered a large-scale Canadian import enjoyed by many countries and their residents,” the report states. In short, internationals students are big business. To put it into context, a 2012 Foreign Affairs, Trade and Development Canada report that looked at Canada’s more than 218,000 long-term international students indicated that they contributed $6.9 billion in expenditure and $4.2 billion in GDP, which supported 70, 240 jobs and contributed $391 million in tax dollars. In January 2014, the federal government announced a goal to double the country’s international students by 2022 and acknowledged that in order to attract foreign students, a feasible means of obtaining permanent residence status would be needed”. - See more at: http://www.southasianpost.com/article/5955-low-immigrant-voter-turnout.html#sthash.d6WQtJ7s.dpuf

Funny Doug, only a few of the Canadian students go elsewhere under student visas. And yet since it is such a big business, billion dollars plus and counting - the governments are determined to double the foreign students. Does that satisfied the education establishment?  No, they want foreign students to have work experience, and so the education class was not at happy when six job classifications were taken away - “six occupations (cooks, food service supervisors, administrative officers, administrative assistants, accounting technicians and bookkeepers and retail sales supervisors) were no longer eligible for CEC applicants.”

Sure just double the amount of foreign students, and the problem is solved. From the Canadian Federation of Students - it makes far more sense, and the numbers are damning - far more sense to look at the whole picture to which the whole K to post-secondary including government only seem to find solutions for the silos. Just imagine what doubling the foreign students will do to youth unemployment numbers and student debt? 

By the way Doug, it is an eight billion dollar industry in foreign students for Canada. If only some of the profits could be filter down to Canadian students who are losing grants, scholarships and have to borrow from one year to the next and as well have a part-time job.

Europe your post 07/31 10:34 am.

Your commentary on curriculum is spot on!  The heart of what you speak to in terms of Europe and Canada is curriculum.  Curriculum that became a political football with Mike Harris and then was lobbed to Rae….. and then punted to the liberals.

Curriculum disjointed, without any sort of understanding what and how children learn….. in the hands of politicians and self-serving ambitious pygmies.

Curriculum!

all the best with that!  Kicking teachers is for amateurs.

Bev writes.

‘Just like you,  I’m only proficient in one’.

This comment was a response to my re-direct that English is my second language…. but not my last,  I am multilingual to a fault.

Would you kind ’ ladies’  (Nancy and Amanda)
stand aside so those of us who know a bit of something- something can help the parents looking for help in real time?  Both of you have no children in the system.  That is why you are   so eager to blow it up.

Simply no skin in the game. 

Your slam Amanda brought me to tears as it reminded of how hard it was to be an immigrant in the early seventies.  My parents had no idea how much shit we suffered as children.  Happily we had no idea how much shit they had to absorb and pretended it was sugar.  That is what happens in immigrant families - we carry on- and we get it done.  Very little moaning and even less finger pointing.

Here is a challenge to you dear hearts, an immigrant, scholar, and political dissident that escaped the iron curtain in 1969 wrote a comprehensive exploration of the bitter sweet experience of choosing to be outlander for the children and the subsequent generations. 
“Ako Chuti Cudzina” was written 15 years after exile .  It is archived at the Bratislava University for easy reference. 

It is a big world with many stories.  I can read “Ako Chuti Cudzina” and understand it and speak with some authority on the content.  I CAN also read all sorts of material in English and speak with authority on its content.  WHY?  Because intellectual acumen is not anglocentric !

Tom,

Just working my way trough this stream of messages.

Tom,  CHALLENGE: post three real references or links to you vague assertion that there are schools with 75% failure rates?

Potent - AKA Mirka - Actually, the education establishment had a great deal of control over the curriculum since the beginning of the 20th century. Mirka and his ilk just like to point to the political powers and blame them solely for the state of curriculum as if the politicians were the authors of the curriculum. It has always been the K to 12 education establishment who had control over key aspects of the curriculum.

Curriculum development is shaped and influenced on multiple variables across the social, political and cultural changes in society, the country and the world. Four videos outlining the complexity by Professor Greene on the History of Curriculum.
Part 1 - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tx_VFbQznco
Part 2 - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kN63cUkeLzQ
Part 3 - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iUQQ5GXLseM
Part 4 - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jkDP93U3vcM

In the Canadian Encyclopedia - “Curriculum development in Canada has gone from teaching survival skills, both practical and cultural, to emphasizing self-fulfillment and standards-based achievements. This evolution mirrors that which has occurred in other developed countries, namely in Europe.”  http://www.thecanadianencyclopedia.ca/en/article/curriculum-development/

From UNESCO - This paper said it best - “In fact, the term curriculum is mostly used to refer to the existing contract between society, the State and educational professionals with regard to the educational experiences that learners should undergo during a certain phase of their lives. For the majority of authors and experts, the curriculum defines: (i) why; (ii) what; (iii) when; (iv) where; (v) how; and (vi) with whom to learn.
Using educational concepts, we can say that the curriculum defines the educational foundations and contents, their sequencing in relation to the amount of time available for the learning experiences, the characteristics of the teaching institutions, the characteristics of the learning experiences, in particular from the point of view of methods to be used, the resources for learning and teaching (e.g. textbooks and new technologies), evaluation and teachers’ profiles.”  http://www.ibe.unesco.org/fileadmin/user_upload/archive/AIDS/doc/cecilia_e.pdf

Pity the parents either have to pay for the services of tutors or become tutors/teachers at home for what is no longer taught in the fundamentals and knowledge. I somehow doubt the politicians are to blame but the UNESCO paper does state it is the hidden curriculum that is not written - ” as the entire range of educational experiences promoted by schools and teachers through practices that are neither necessarily obligations nor written down.” The hidden curriculum promoted by schools and educators is the likely culprit for parents paying for private tutor services or doing the tutoring at home.

Dear Tom,

I never read Nancy posts, it is not good my personal mental health,

I still welcome from you dear man three sources - Canadian-  to support your assertions.

much appreciated - walking our talk is half the battle. 

Mirka, slamming Canadians who are third or more generations is not earning any brownie points from the crowd of non-educators that are diverse across the span in knowledge, experiences and they too have their own stories of hardship, triumph and tribulations. Such as the stories on my mother’s side of the family in the 1920s and 1930s. Imagine that, a group of hard working educator-nuns ensure that their students were fluent in German and English in both verbal and written forms by the end of grade 9. Most students left at the end of grade 9 because entry into grade 10, require a tuition fee. Then again as the scholar you claim to be, you would know the historical past of Catholic education in Ontario. It is said the Catholic schools of the past were superior in quality in every measure compared to the public schools of the day. As the scholar as you claimed to be, you also would know the systemic barriers and discrimination embedded within the Ontario and Federal governments of the first half of the 20th century that played a starring role in the development of the education model in Ontario. Immigrants long before the 1970s have experience the systemic   discrimination of the political and economic powers. Just remember Mirka, the immigrants that came before you are the ones that paved the roads and pathways of immigrant lives of today in Canada.  Making it a little bit easier for the next set of immigrants to arrived in Canada.

However, according to Mirka Canadian parents should keep their lips zipped because we don’t have children attending the K to 12. It speaks more to the dogma and culture statements of the communist states, than it does to Canada. If it was not for the First Settlers of which my father’s family hails from, the very idea of having their lips zipped by orders of the leading settlers, would be a call to become activists. If not, it might very well lead to the deaths of the settlers. Mirka, my ancestors on both sides of the family, were not the type of people to stay silent.  They believed in freedom. Some would call them the first freedom fighters who did not take kindly to the political and economic powers of the 9th century to the 19th century. When the New World opened up, my ancestors had the conviction and courage to start over, carrying skills and knowledge. It is that diversity in places like Canada and United States that would prevent a Stalin leader from ever materializing. It is the same diversity that will refuse to remain quiet because we do not have children attending the K to 12 schools. From my understanding, when good people do nothing the outcomes are bad for the health and welfare of the citizens. The first time I heard that, I was about 10 years old, sitting at the kitchen table while a grandmother who escaped Russia during the Russian Revolution was a wee bit upset with us kids because we did nothing to stopped the actions of another kid. Quite frankly Mirka, most of the immigrants that I knew as a youth were not pining for their home countries. They were so glad that they had the courage and convictions to leave their countries. They never let us kids forget the value of freedom and nor the tendency of governments and its agencies to abuse their power over the little guys.

As parents, we have every right to be at this table. After all if it was only parents whose children were attending school, who were picking up the tab for the K to 12 schools. The state of education would be in dire straits. Pity, one of the reasons why Soviet USSR failed was because the people had no rights to be at the table of the professionals, policy wonks and the 5-year planners. If they did not like it, they were shipped off to a Siberia camp for daring to speak up on the whacky plans of the Soviet elite.

Doug writes ( 08/01)

” That is a scary outing of someone’s personal info.”

Thanks Doug, interesting that you are the only voice of decorum in this ‘moderated’ blog.

Dear Tara/Dorie

you write:

“..... challenge Potent suggestion that school councils in Ontario are working even marginally so as conduits to either the greater community or in promoting a partnership between educators and parents. In short, they do nothing of the sort.”

Silly stupid me responds:
YUP, that was my point.  OUR school council did in spades what you suggest cannot be done Dorie— it was done. IT was a hard slog of 6 years that involved research, data, and reports to school board involving   .... well…...research and data…...........

Ironically, I am witting a book/manual to how to get this done as what we did was spectacular!  An efficiency enema for what ails….......... spectacular.

Dorie you the other vociferous contributors on this blog will HATE this…. this stuff gets done each and every day all it takes is courage and more courage.  Posting blogs that dis empower and paralyze parents is the antithesis of courage. 

Dorie does continue:

..... see her “team” as having “many winning seasons” when you’re head cheerleader for the system that continues to see way too many kids fall through the cracks. What better instrument of support for all things the public system has to offer than a teacher/parent/teacher/parent. It’s a perfect vortex of a web for unsuspecting parents isn’t it?

I respond;

Sorry Dorie,  We got it done,  sorry that you did not, honestly,sorry,  I get your rage and the other silly it is an effort to hide your incompetence and to justify why you failed.

Sorry Dorie, for succeeding.  . 

So sorry that I made it work for my children and hundred of others in our learning community.  It would have been easier on my family life to just take care of my own.  We launched a revolution Dorie - a capacity building exercise.  The fact that you dismiss that reflects on you.

Dear Katie,

you missed at least 6 other awards and a feature on TVO for my dear friend Mirka.  What a shame, you could have dismissed all those accolades with the same sniff and whiff.

By all means let’s continue to dis empower CANADIAN parents and paralyze them with American horror stories. 

I have kids in the system and am happy to have good people who care about education and their progress be part of a difficult conversation.

Helping is hard.;  Making a difference is incredibly hard.  Being a cyber bully - easy- a monkey could do it

Note for Doug Little:

Doug, you wrote:  “Americans, like everyone else only worse are loath to blame themselves. We have allowed too much poverty. I am too poor I am too absent from my children’s lives…...
The only difference between the low scoring Americans and say the high scoring Finns is the % of children in poverty.
Posted by Doug Little on 07/28 at 11:59 AM

Doug, you are wrong, wrong, wrong.  Read “Finnish Lessons"by Pasi Solberg.  Only one of the many differences is that a math teacher (say) has to have a Masters in Math, which indicates that he knows something about math.  There are dozens of other important differences.

Frank.

American child poverty 20%

Finnish child poverty 5%

I know Pasi read his book cover to cover talked to him at length and co-respond with him regularly.

He agrees with me.

Ask Doretta and Malkin if they support masters degrees for teachers. I do.

No matter how many name changes you make Mirka, until you provide the evidence to support your contentions of what is really heated hyperbolic rhetoric that is giving a bad name to the education profession, you will not be seen as a professional educator as you would like us to see you.

Quite frankly, you remind me of teens denouncing the teacher for the low grade on a test, when in fact it was the teen that did not study for the test. I supposed Mirka doesn’t have that problem as a parent as she doesn’t see the systemic barriers of the K to 12 that disenfranchises and silences parents and the public.

Key statement - “So sorry that I made it work for my children and hundred of others in our learning community.  It would have been easier on my family life to just take care of my own.  We launched a revolution Dorie - a capacity building exercise.  The fact that you dismiss that reflects on you.” When I first started out in the advocacy for my child, who insisted that my child had no learning disability, but she did, I entered the world of the LD parents. A much wiser LD parent veteran, warn us of the language of the K to 12 educators. The revolution that Mirka speaks of is the capacity building of co-opting the parents and the public to work on the behalf of the K to 12 best interests.

Capacity building definitions are according to the field. In the case of the K to 12 education system, capacity building spoken by an educator usually refers to building capacity for the educators of the school. One has no idea what Mirka means by her success. For all we know, the success she is speaking of is the fundraising of $50,000 to finance education research at the school level or the more common one, purchasing the ‘nice-to-have’ items such as a new fridge for the teachers’ staff room or the purchasing of specialized software. Fullan on page 8 - Focusing on accountability (vs capacity building) - http://edsource.org/wp-content/uploads/Fullan-Wrong-Drivers1.pdf

Capacity building within the K to 12 is all about reducing accountability measures that focuses on the outcomes. Capacity building exercises by the K to 12 crowd is all about having one and all to focus on the processes of education in real time. Outcomes are not important, but rather the activities of the processes that leads to improved capacity of the school. 
On the Ontario education website - The Capacity Building Series by the EQAO - http://www.edu.gov.on.ca/eng/literacynumeracy/inspire/research/capacityBuilding.html
In Wikipedia - “The emergence of capacity building as a leading developmental concept in the 1990s occurred due to a confluence of factors:
New philosophies that promoted empowerment and participation, like Paulo Freire’s “Education for Critical Consciousness” (1973), which emphasized that education, could not be handed down from an omniscient teacher to an ignorant student rather it must be achieved through the process of a dialogue among equals.” http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capacity_building

Maria L. (Mirka?) 
You sound just like Mirka, Potent, etc., and you also sound very angry.
 
Firstly, I don’t see why anyone would be angry with parents who have failed to get what they want for their children.  As far as I’m concerned, they need sympathy.

Secondly, why do you take it for granted that parents have to fight a system they’re paying dearly for in order to get their children educated?  It doesn’t strike you as morally and ethically wrong on the part of educrats not to deliver?

If you are Mirka, and I upset you in an earlier blog posting,  I must offer you an apology.  I was wrong.
 
Hey, perhaps we should all follow Sufi’s wisdom before posting:
1) is it the truth;
2) is it necessary; and,
3) is it kind.

Doug Little,

You are either purposely irritating people by making ridiculous statements, or you’re completely blinded by your position. Anyone who thinks Canada’s education system is anything except a complete disaster is delusional.

My kids use the “Kumon” system for 20 minutes per day x 2 subjects and learn more reading and mathematics in that short time than they ever THOUGHT about learning during the 6 hours a day they waste at their local public school.

It’s a DISGRACE.

You’re lucky I’m not the Minister of Education. I would immediately disband the entire education establishment, and simply license the “Kumon” system across Canada.

Bye bye unions, bye bye Doug Little, hello results.

Time magazine calls the Canadian education system the world’s best based on having the world’s highest % of post secondary education completion. Results my friends. Results.

I guess your kids are kind of weak if they really need Kumon.

Most kids don’t need it.

You would not be the education minister very long Tyn and Doug Little retired in 2008.

You think it is that easy right. Mike Harris is about as far right as was ever elected in Ontario. The unions outlived him.

You will find this quite shocking but there is very little support for your position.

Doug,  my son’s an engineer.  For highschool both of my children went to Kumon. 

Please stop insulting parents’ children.  They’re victims of a self-serving union-run monopoly and a puppet government that will do nothing to benefit the students if it would require a little work from the union members and educrats.

Like I said in my post above. Doug Little - delusional, or purposely making ridiculous statements. One of the two.

Time magazine. Yeah,... OK. Quality reading material Doug.

The unions might have outlived Mike Harris, but I’d make Mike Harris look like Tinkerbell. Doug, your hands would tremble every time you opened one of your gold plated, over-entitled, taxpayer funded pension statements.

Tym

Your bluster distracts from any point you might want to make. You are never going to be in a position of power in education. You can rant but you are like King Knute yelling at the tides.

Doug,

I may never be the Minister of Education, but eventually someone from the masses of fuming parents and taxpayers WILL take over.

Watch out!

Not too worried Tym

There is almost zero support for your position. You will find out when you have more experience with politics, the one who promises dramatic change loses badly (Tim Hudak). The one who promises steady-as-she-goes slow progressive change wins.

You are leading a one car parade I’m afraid.

Nobody is concerned.

I want to disagree and agree with Doug in this one missive..

Doug wrote:

“Those systems are not superior to the Canadian system as PISA shows.”

Take PISA results with a grain of salt.  They are suspect on scientific and statistical grounds.  Further, they are norm referenced (a ranking) not criterion referenced (records of subject mastery). Canada is a bit above international averages (one of the “suspect” numbers) which could mean, for instances, we are “the best of a sorry lot”.  No hint of mastery.

I agree with Doug that post-secondary education should be available free to all, WITH A LOT OF PRETTY RIGID RULES ABOUT MARKET DEMAND FOR CERTAIN SPECIALTIES.  We don’t want or need too many PHDs on the subject of the mobility of the left hind leg of the fruit fly.

I was the lucky beneficiary of free tuition and a small living allowance available to WW!! veterans who needed to finish high school and take Engineering.  (I’ve been lucky all my life - you should meet my wife of 67 years.)  Result: 36 years with that wicked multinational Westinghouse Canada, who gave me endless fascinating jobs, put up with my blunders, sent me all over the world both to study and to teach Production Planning and Control, the subject of my hardcover book published by Reston; little if any of which would have happened without my having received my veterans’ benefits.

Canada’s industrial resurgence in the 30 years after the war (since lost, sadly) was possible in no small measure because of our government’s policy (and don’t read politics into that - I mean POLICY) of educating thousands of engineers-scientists free of charge. We were lucky, lucky, lucky.  Why don’t we do it again?

So remember when you turn on a light that you owe me: for I was one of a bunch of engineers who designed, built, and installed the huge generators at Sir Adam Beck #2 power plant at Niagara Falls.  I in turn owe my priceless chance to contribute to that mighty accomplishment that I received a free Engineering education

Please excuse an old man’s blabbing on.  But I had to get it off my chest.

Frank.. 

Hey Doug, just to add - this will be coming to Ontario for Ontario parents when the next teachers’ strike rolls around. “On Thursday, two days later, Finance Minister Michael de Jong took the opportunity to announce the government would not be swallowing the money, but instead using it to pay parents $40 a day per child to temporarily replace the school system – should the teachers continue their strike into September.
With this very intriguing move, Minister de Jong said, “Parents can utilize that money to acquire tutoring for their children; they can use that money to explore other educational opportunities as they see fit and for some parents, it’ll be basic daycare.”
The teachers union (BCTF) seem to be caught flat footed by de Jong’s move to put children’s educational choices into the hands of parents. If the BCTF, with their monopoly, continues to highjack the public school system, they may well end up destroying it.” - See more at: http://www.mrtimes.com/opinion/just-saying-teachers-union-cutting-own-throat-1.1273258#sthash.7o3tQGHx.dpuf

It won’t take long for parents in neighbourhoods to figure it out - “It won’t take long for the parents of today’s elementary-aged children to discover that if the parents of 15 children band together, they will have $12,000 per month collectively to educate their children. The curriculum is not a secret. It is the same curriculum that all home-school, religiously based, and private schools follow – which they claim to enhance. 
If the BCTF is not careful, they might end up with one of the most liberal voucher systems for education in North America.”

On another new trend of the K to 12 crowd, instead of having their focus on the steady achievement and progress of ALL students, they rather track the mental health numbers of their students. So much easier to blame low literacy and numeracy levels of students on mental health problems eh Doug? I guess you have no idea how parents with children in the primary grades are being accused by the K to 12 education crowd of questionable parenting skills and if not that, telling the parents their children are too thick for grade 1 and are not academically inclined. http://www.madinamerica.com/2014/07/algorithmic-management/

Soon Doug, there will be a reckoning and the K to 12 establishment will be paying the price for not providing a level of education quality for all students.

Bev, you have nothing to apologize for. In fact you’re bang on IMO!

Mirka/Omnipotent/Maria Lickova(MiOmMa) = one and the same.  It’s the classic stand-by for educatorcrats (best of both annoying pests) when they do what they do best….and in this case, on this forum not very well.
MiOmMa seems muddled and confused however not convincing.

A classic ploy by educatorcrats blinded narcissistically by their own reflections is shown clearly by MiOmMa as she practices the art of divide and conquer in her separate responses to each and every poster. This accomplishes two things 1) attempts to personalize the venom while 2) appearing to give MiOmMa an undivided audience and lets her put more words on the page because again there is nothing the educatorcrats like better than hearing their own words it’s reading them or to be given such welcome forum as right here at SFT.

Brilliant strategy by SQE folks I must admit.

Nobody is worried Nancy. Take a valium.

Guys, ... the level of discussion has become abyssimal ..

In my naivete I thought that perhaps we were all curious to find out what makes the other side so adamant in their views ...c’mon we are all educated people talking about education :-(!

Seriously, if this was the first time I read this blog I would think both the parents and the educators posting here are a bit ga-ga and I would not read it again.
Maybe that’s exactly Mr.Doug’s intention.

By the way we all knew what Doug was going to say.. he’s been saying the exact same thing for years ... although to me even his post was very interesting.

His wife’s very successful high school is based on principles that are exactly the opposite of what Mr Doug says is already working very well in the public system.?!. ..well, to each its own .. I’ve met other people that could hold true two contradicting facts ... interesting as a borderline personality disorder.

Nancy, with all due respect, I appreciate your effort. For me however the majority of your posts don’t work. All the work you put into finding relevant information would be much more effective if you made fewer and clearer points .

It is her school but I agree with the way she handles most things.

I agree very small classes

I agree certified teachers

This is the core of the success.

We prep them for tests they must take not that we agree with.

We have quite a liberal way of teaching English through drama.

Picture a girl standing on a table reading Juliette’s lines while her Romeo stands on the floor.

Some rules are tough. No cell phones or laptops M-F except when teacher unlocks cupboard. None after 10:30 PM

Supervised HW 2 hours per night. Help available.
It is a mix of progressive and traditional methods.

fromEurope,

In my experience the discussion ALWAYS becomes   a b y s m a l   when dealing with “educators”.

Years ago at social functions when the table would stumble onto this topic, no matter how polite and civil you tried to argue your point it would immediately degenerate into a hostile bullying session if you weren’t a recognized “educator” (whatever that means). “How dare you offer your opinion if you aren’t an educator”, etc., etc..

So now I just jump in with both barrels blazing. Everyone gets their cards on the table faster, and I feel good when 3 or 4 people at the table say “Wow, I had NO IDEA that was going on in our schools! No wonder the two employees I just hired can’t spell their own names, let alone compose a letter to one of our clients.”

The problem, in my opinion, is that you have 1 out of 20 educators who are worth their weight in gold. Wonderful people, and very good at their profession. They change lives. Another 15 of the 19 mean well, show up every day, drink the kool-aid, throw their hands up in frustration, and collect their ransom every 2 weeks. The other 4 ... well, I’ll stop there at the risk of making the discussion even more abysmal, LOL.

So you have 1 real mover and shaker, and some random number probably between 5 and 10 that may have some positive impact. But you’re saddled with a total payroll of 20 + 20 special aids, principals, administrators, etc. achieving very poor results overall. What do you think happens in a private company that operates like that?

But in the mystical never never land of education, no one knows anything except the educators, so all manner of idiotic arguments and fancy learning theories (theories, not laws) are invented, the government throws another pot of money on the table, and the system devolves even further into some twisted fantasy.

The educators spend their entire careers regurgitating these fancy paradigms amongst themselves, while the parents - unencumbered by the bureaucracy and nonsense - only see the results. And those results - or lack thereof - are crystal clear to the parents.

So two sides, each speaking a different language.

Time for a drastic change I’d say. Like dismantling the schools and moving to 100% online learning. Ah, but that’s a topic for another day, after I reload and wait for the onslaught of angry educators bristling at the thought of anyone daring to unseat their tidy little monopoly.

I guess when the facts don’t support your argument you just launch into a teacher bashing screed.

There has never in the history of humankind or a nation on this beena place as well educated as Canada today. Never nowhere!

Could it be even better?

Of course but that will be expensive. Universal public ECE is one of the last great hurdles.

“Guys, ... the level of discussion has become abyssimal ..”

I don’t think so Europe. I think that it’s been provoked and what you see is something that should happen more often – a push back by those who have experienced something other than a public education system in Ontario that is working well, accountable to parents and is using tax money wisely.

Dear Mirka/Maria 8/04 9:02

I didn’t miss a thing then, and I’m not missing anything now.

I also have not missed that you’re now demonstrating another classic tactic used by educatorcrats when things aren’t going their way, get asked one too many intelligent questions or simply are confronted by individuals whose experiences and choice of public education are not your own.  Classic cry “bully” when you’re the provocateur.  Folks here are merely reacting.

Doug,

As long as you keep repeating idiotic statements, it remains clear that you are DELUSIONAL. Just because your union sends out newsletters with scripts and talking points doesn’t mean they’re true.

Katie,

EXACTLY! Every single one of us needs to push back more often. Eventually we will be heard. That’s why I come out with both barrels blazing. I don’t care how many people I piss off. I don’t care how much the educators repeat their propaganda. Even if 1 more person hears about this atrocity, someday things will change.

I agree, Tym.  Teachers think that by shouting insults at parents and taxpayers that this will somehow make them right.  I often wonder how they’d ever make in the real world.

The nonsense that because we’re not in the classroom that we have no idea?  Hellooo!  This is not post-secondary school.  We know the subject matter very well, and today’s students aren’t learning.

Look at it this way, teachers:  when G.M. had to recall their cars,  did they tell the public that we didn’t understand because we don’t do their job?  When G.M. was told that their cars were faulty did G.M. shout at their customers and name call?  Was the public told that we have to continue paying for our cars and that in order to produce better cars, we had to pay more because G.M. says so, and they want more money from us because they genuinely care only about us?

The above is how you look to non-educators, and it also shows the glaring contrast between the behavior seen in private industry (they’re accountable) and state-run monopolies which have become so powerful that they now have the power to elect puppet governments who refuse to do the right thing by fixing a disastrous ed system.

Enjoy your luxury of shouting and name-calling, rather than trying to fix our system that is ruining many of your charges’ lives.

Tym

You can call names with invective and rhetoric but where are your facts?

Time Magazine delusional?

PISA. DELUSIONAL.

StatsCan delusional

Everybody is delusional because you don’t like the facts.

Name a country with a higher % of post secondary education.

Canada is the ONLY NATION ON EARTH over 50%

For those under 44 years old it is 60%

Name somebody doing this well.

Somebody is delusional all right

Bev

Knowing the content is not 40% of the job.

Talk about the real world, I doubt 80% of you would last a week kn a classroom.

Nobody in the history of the world is doing a better job ghat Canada is today.

Funny when I say this I never hear oh no you are wrong.

This country or that country is doing better. I don’t hear those answers.

Bev and Tym

A little reading material

http://newsfeed.time.com/2012/09/27/and-the-worlds-most-educated-country-is/

Effective school boards? On the contrary.

Thanks in no small part to the adoption of the Carver model of governance that crept in to boards two decades ago school boards are proving themselves to rarely be effective. We were warned that school communities would be squeezed out of decision making years ago.

Thanks also to the glut and growth of boards when by all accounts we’re still in student decline in the province they’re not affordable or sustainable in their current form.

We also can’t forget the how the McGuinty/Wynne governance legislation helped further neuter school boards so they are essentially long arms of the MOE bureaucracy and henchmen for school closures.

If I had to describe my school board I’d use words like – unnecessary, vacant, dinosaurs.

I have to laugh at the notion that Charles Pascal is critical of the TDSB.  That would never have happened twenty years ago.

I think a move to get rid of school boards is long overdue in this province.  At the very least they should be keeping pace with declining enrolments but instead they’re costing us more for doing the same of lesser job.

Doug,

It’s WAY beyond reading time for me. You have NO IDEA how far past that I am.

READ MY LIPS: I don’t care about irrelevant studies and manipulated statistics. I don’t even care if someone claims Canada is #1 in the world for education! If the kids can’t do better than adding 1 + 3 on their fingers while they’re taking EQAO tests (that’s not bluster, that’s reality) then as far as I’m concerned the results are a DISGRACE.

And I pay your salary pal. And don’t you ever forget it.

Like I said, as long as you keep spouting your nonsense I will continue to humour you. I have lots of shells left, and you and your legions of educrats don’t get a single pass from me anymore.

You have an absolute right to your opinion Tym.

It is a very narrow one that few support if we look at polls or elections. If you like life on the educational/political fringe be my guest.

Can you name one politician who supports you? Can you point to data that supports you?

Do you just like pot boiler rhetoric?